The Trump Presidency

Julio3000 said:
There's obviously a push and pull inside the administration on Russia. A lot of key people in the exec branch and and Rs in congress are quite hawkish, so there's a bit of a schizophrenic approach.

But we can look at it and draw a few conclusions, can't we? On one hand, the reversal of policy on Ukraine arms sales and the announcement of new sanctions. On the other hand, inviting Lavrov and Kislyak to the Oval, publicly accepting Putin's disavowal of election meddling, offering Putin a face to face meeting, the fact that they dragged feet for months on new sanctions, then announced them, but aren't apparently enforcing them.

So it doesn't exactly stack up to puppethood, but it's an odd and continuing display of deference towards a legit bad actor. Is that even subject to debate?
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Come on, you've debated with sturg long enough to know for him it's only black and white and no gray area.
 
Meanwhile, Scott Pruitt seems to be an uncapped well of sewage.

Got a huge mortgage loan that his income did not support, hired the banker who gave it to him at EPA despite the fact that the guy had gotten the death professional penalty from federal banking regulators.

Bought a house below market value and hired the lobbyist who sold it to him. Another lobby group with business in front of him made up the difference to the seller.

Got a sweetheart deal on a condo in DC. The lobbyist who rented it to him first claimed that he had no business with EPA, but it was subsequently determined that he did.

Expensive flights and office renovation, fired or reassigned career employees who flagged it.

Dude is the living embodiment of the swamp. How does he still have a job?
 
What a world we live in where celebrities feel the need to apologize for saying they'd vote for trump.
 
The Daily Caller
‏Verified account @DailyCaller

Trump Orders Homeland Security Not To Let Illegal Immigrant Caravans Into The US




David Corn
‏Verified account @DavidCornDC
18m18 minutes ago

David Corn Retweeted The Daily Caller

Still waiting for this headline:

"Trump Orders Homeland Security To Do Everything Possible

To Prevent Russian Intervention in 2018 Mid-Term Elections."
 
Runnin said:
In the end it had no effect and he warned his pals for days that it was coming.
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It's called a warning order and it is standard operating procedure in instances like this.

Turkey, Iran, Russia, France, Great Britain (among others) have troops in Syria.

You just don't start bombing.

That would be stupid.

Innocents could be killed.

A major war could be started.

And then you would be in here whining about an operation that was hastily executed.

In fact, I'm pretty sure that you've argued that the recent bombings were just a ploy anyways. Or was that the Libby pardon?

Are you willing to give Trump credit for the idea in these instances?

Honestly, I get lost in this harebrained **** that our resident Facebook-as-news triumvirate upchucks on a daily basis.
 
Julio3000 said:
So it doesn't exactly stack up to puppethood, but it's an odd and continuing display of deference towards a legit bad actor. Is that even subject to debate?
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Deference towards a bad actor ... that is the second most powerful country in the world.

I'm not sure what other tact there is.

What would your approach be?
 
Hawk said:
Deference towards a bad actor ... that is the second most powerful country in the world.

I'm not sure what other tact there is.

What would your approach be?
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Hoo boy. That one is stretched so far you can see clear through it.
 
You've contorted an oval office meeting, sanctions play, and state meetings into some sort of ominous "deference".

Yet when I submit that diplomacy between global superpowers is complicated (and earnestly ask for an alternative approach) I'm the one stretching things?
 
Hawk said:
You've contorted an oval office meeting, sanctions play, and state meetings into some sort of ominous "deference".

Yet when I submit that diplomacy between global superpowers is complicated (and earnestly ask for an alternative approach) I'm the one stretching things?
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You said ominous, not me. Given the circumstances, those choices seem unusually deferential towards Putin and his government.

Let's say Trump hadn't had Lavrov and Kislyak over for tea in the Oval*, hadn't publicly stated that he believed Putin's disavowal of the election hacks, had acted more expeditiously on sanctions, and hadn't invited Putin to exchange state visits.

You're saying that would have amounted to a dangerous diplomatic provocation, or something?

There was nothing earnest about your question.

*and boy, didn't that go swimmingly
 
Julio3000 said:
You said ominous, not me. Given the circumstances, those choices seem unusually deferential towards Putin and his government.

Let's say Trump hadn't had Lavrov and Kislyak over for tea in the Oval*, hadn't publicly stated that he believed Putin's disavowal of the election hacks, had acted more expeditiously on sanctions, and hadn't invited Putin to exchange state visits.

You're saying that would have amounted to a dangerous diplomatic provocation, or something?

There was nothing earnest about your question.

*and boy, didn't that go swimmingly
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I’m confused.

Are these particular events you’ve outlined significant or not?

If they are significant - and the alternative, as you infer, was simply ‘not’ - then what do diplomatic relations between the two countries look like in the realm of not? A President refusing to meet with the Russian foreign minister, refusing to entertain a state visit. Keep in mind, these actions would represent a normalization of relations between the two countries.

The ‘not’ category would be history repeating. And look where that dithering got us.
 
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goldfly said:
you must search out stuff to get upset about
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says guy who got upset over:

1) the president's son getting divorced
2) the president's son tweeting about tampons and bacon
3) the president's son hunting in africa
4) the president's tweets from 5 years ago
 
Hawk said:
says guy who got upset over:

1) the president's son getting divorced
2) the president's son tweeting about tampons and bacon
3) the president's son hunting in africa
4) the president's tweets from 5 years ago
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only one of those i am "upset" about

i would use the word angry or pissed off about though

didn't have to search too much for it either
 
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