Trade Deadline/Rumors thread
- Thread starter sturg33
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Horsehide Harry
<B>Mr. Free Trade</B>
They should take what they can for him and make sure they don't miss the opportunity. He's the RF for gods sake and hes devolved into a punch and judy guy with no speed. He never was a power guy really but was at least a little respectable. He's owed $33M over the next 3 years. I don't care how good he is in the clubhouse he's not worth that. He's a fourth corner outfielder at best.
As far as getting a bad reputation for sign and trade, I think you can let it get around that he was brought in to be a production guy, fill a role in the middle of the line-up and it turns out he just isn't that at this point in his career. He needs to go to a team who has their core and he can be a veteran at the beginning or end of their lineup.
Besides, the Braves have always been a team who is unwilling to do no-trades so they don't exactly have the most friendly reputation for FA anyway. In Cox's day, players came because they wanted to play for him and a winner. Freddies not Bobby, but if you put a winner on the field, or show that you are well on your way, AND you are competitive with the cash (which the Braves now have to be - no discounts to come to the Braves anymore), players will come.
yeezus
It's OVER 5,000!
If those prospects are included, it's a no-brainer IMO.
Horsehide Harry
<B>Mr. Free Trade</B>
Players will go to the cash and winning
This is just...I don't know where to start. A 4th OF? Good grief. I've already explained why Markakis is actually underpaid given the production he's given us right now. People get too caught up on what 'type' of player a guy is. Markakis has been a good player for us so far.
Horsehide Harry
<B>Mr. Free Trade</B>
Markakis has been a marginal RF for the Braves right now and will be an absolute albatross moving forward. His signing was the most bizarre in any Braves offseason I can remember. He absolutely doesn't fit with the program, be it win today or rebuild today and win tomorrow.
I don't care how gritty he is, how good his leadership or that he catches the balls he gets to. He is a terrible fit for RF. His bat plays well at short or 2nd but not RF. Not on a winning team.
And, it's not going to get better as he ages. That's not how these things work. Could he bounce back and provide a little power next year, say 10-15hr at a .280 clip? Maybe. I think it unlikely but maybe. But even IF he does he's still way out of range for what is good for the position and what the Braves need to be a good team.
Move him. Move him now. If you can. Which I doubt because I can't see anyone out there in baseball willing to bring him on at what he is owed.
Id like to see the support for him being worth the contract. I think at best you can say this year he was about worth what he's paying in year 1 of the deal with 3 more albatrosses on the horizon. Right now he's an average NL hitting right fielder with below average defense, but lots of grit and toughness
No, Markakis has not been marginal. He will be worth more than 2 WAR this year, which is worth about $15 million on the FA market. There's no reason to believe he will lose that much of his hitting and on-base ability in the next 3 years. He already has no power and has still been valuable. That contract is extremely unlikely to become an albatross.
I also don't care about his grit or leadership. But he is a good player as a RF right now. Sorry if that bothers you. WAR is determined relative to your position, and he's a decent one and worth what we're paying him.
The overreaction on Markakis among Braves fans is bizarre. The idea that he is one of our main problems and must be moved at all costs is just ridiculous.
Kazmir to the Astros.
EDIT: Didn't see it on the last page since everything has been about Nick the Stick.
EDIT: Didn't see it on the last page since everything has been about Nick the Stick.
I've already explained it, pretty simply. On the FA market right now, a win is worth about $7 million. He has been worth 1.4 WAR and is on pace to be over 2 by the end of the year. So he's already been worth about $10 million and should end the year around $15 million.
It's pretty straightforward.
So you don't believe that his neck surgery has anything to do with his power deficiencies.
Do you think this is the type of output offensively that we should expect from here on out?
This is with his producing limited power as well. I just don't see how anyone can make an argument that he won't hit for more power next year.
weso1
<B>Clique Leader</B>
Yeah, it doesn't make much sense, but obviously something is giving Bowman reason to believe that Markakis is not available in a trade.
Putting 7.5 per WAR for position players has been proven wrong. Pitchers go for significantly higher price per WAR so the average gets brought to about 6 per win....but that's the average for all players. Cost per win for position players is typically much lower (relievers are like 18 million per win)
So then Markakis is trending towards being a small bargain in his first year in which he had no power as a result of surgery in the offseason?
Horsehide Harry
<B>Mr. Free Trade</B>
WAR breaks down when you look at the construction of the TEAM. In a vacuum, his WAR may be fine. But this Braves team is constructed now and the foreseeable future where RF HAS to be a power/production position. If you don't get power/production out of RF then where does it come from? 1B? Freddie is OK but is high end middle of the pack as a power 1B. C? No. 2B? No (and you get yourself in trouble when you try to compensate at a non traditional position for deficiencies at a traditional position (Uggla), SS? NO. 3B? No. CF? A little better than typical because of Maybins play but will it last and is it enough to outweigh RF? no. LF? Don't make me laugh.
Bottom line is, good teams are league average or better power teams. You can look it up. This team, as constructed is nowhere near that and has no path there at this time without addressing 3B, LF AND hopefully RF.
But, I will say that the fact that Markakis is showing almost 2 WAR shows you just how pitiful the position is around baseball.
He hasn't had power in 3 years.
I expect him to maintain to decline over the next few years. BP was actually pretty close on him this year. We will be lucky to have a .725+ OPS from here out. (maybe next year?)
I just want wins. I'd like power, but I'll take a good average and high OBP from every position if that gets me the wins. Lacking power in RF doesn't reduce the wins we're getting out of other positions. If everybody's getting on base at a .380 clip, we'll be fine.
And giles, that's fine. It still makes him worth what we're paying him this year, which is all I ever said. I don't know why people think he's going to take a massive dip over the next couple years. He's a different player than BJ or Uggla; he's a far better hitter in general. I don't see him suddenly dropping off drastically.
And giles, that's fine. It still makes him worth what we're paying him this year, which is all I ever said. I don't know why people think he's going to take a massive dip over the next couple years. He's a different player than BJ or Uggla; he's a far better hitter in general. I don't see him suddenly dropping off drastically.
How can anyone make the argument that he will have power next year? He's had one decent power year out of the last 5.