bravesfanMatt
Steve Harvey'd
Pederson is a great player.. but I am not sure he will ever hit Lefties. I don't want to trade Julio for a platoon bat.. no matter how good he is.
Trade Deadline: What are you willing to do?
- Thread starter Horsehide Harry
- Start date
Agreed. I don't see the Dodgers as a match for Julio. The return for Julio has to be a guy at the Bregman/Moncada level, or it doesn't really improve the club overall...short or long term.
I like the ideas of sending Markakis to the Orioles, and somehow getting Norris from the Padres, even if it is somehow expanded to include Kemp.
The most shocking deal that has a shred of plausibility would be something like Jenkins for Braun and Lucroy. Braun's negative value plus Lucroy's positive value is about equal to a guy like Jenkins. It is a clear "win now" move, but if the Braves keep Julio they need to start making "win now" moves...otherwise his present value is completely wasted on a terrible team.
Russ2dollas
10 yr, $185 million Extension
The orioles need pitching but don't have guys in the JT class imo. Would they get any upgrade from a Wisler, Blair, Jenkins? Could we trade one of those guys for one of their bats. They have some decent guys that look to eb good hitters....prob is a couple are listed as 1B. But maybe they could play LF.
yeezus
It's OVER 5,000!
If you want a legit power hitter who doesn't strikeout for JT, you're going to have a tough (impossible?) time. He doesn't have to hit .270 to be a good hitter. We have a plethora of contact oriented guys, adding one with some K issues but with big power wouldn't be so bad, IMO.
I don't care if we get a legit power hitter for him, I just want a good hitter. I'm fine with a 15 HR guy as long as he's more of a complete hitter. Joc really isn't a good hitter, merely a decent above average wRC+ guy. His main carrying skill offensively is his walk rate, which is not what we need. We have lots of guys that will be able to get on base, we need a couple guys to go with Freddie that can drive them in. And as Matt mentioned, Joc looks like a platoon player so far.
You know what losing teams do? Trade a 3.5-4 WAR pitcher under control for 4.5 years for a 2.5-3 WAR OFer under control for the same 4.5 years just because the OFer hits 20-25 HRs.
It would be a terrible trade.
The Braves either need to get a 3.5-4 WAR guy under control for longer than 4.5 years, or a ~5 WAR guy under control for 3+ years. Anything less is not acceptable. A package of lesser guys is not acceptable. The Braves need to acquire quality, not quantity. They already have quantity.
Tapate50
Well-known member
Does not compute.
Horsehide Harry
<B>Mr. Free Trade</B>
The Braves need both. That's why Pederson definitely doesn't make sense but Gallo would, as long as Gallo came with other good players.
Trading a prospect to fill the holes at C and LF doesn't compute?
Yeah, not sure how you think Braun has negative value there Enscheff. I'm sure he'll reach negative value before the end of his contract, but right now he's a 3-4 WAR or so player, so he's either fairly paid or has a bit of surplus value depending on how you value WAR. The Brewers would want more than Jenkins for Braun by himself.
bravesfanMatt
Steve Harvey'd
I just can't get on board with Gallo. 1600 Abs in the minors with a 40% K rate.. Has anyone in baseball ever been successful with a K rate of 40% in the minors?!?
The PED issues, the recent injury issues, his age, his no trade clause (he might force the acquiring team to pick up his option before he accepts the trade), and the fact he is currently declining gives him a negative trade value. He is certainly not be negative enough to cancel Lucroy's value, but he is definitely not a trade asset. The Brewers will have to eat some money to get anything of note in return.
Tapate50
Well-known member
It is an asinine proposal that you prequalified with having a "shred of plausibility." I don't know how to respond to it quite frankly other than the token "Pass what your smoking" post response.
yeezus
It's OVER 5,000!
Oh, are we capping Pederson at 3 WAR now?
Also didn't say trade for him "just because he hits 20-25 home runs," but putting words in one's mouth seems to be your MO these days.
Braun is currently playing in his age 32 season and should post about 4 WAR. Assuming typical MLB aging curves, he is projected to be worth 3.5, 3, 2.5 and 2 WAR over the next 4 years (11 WAR total), during which he will be paid $80M ($7.3M per WAR). If he forces the acquiring team to pick up his option as a condition of waiving his no trade clause, the numbers go to 12.5 WAR over 5 years and a cost of $91M (still $7.3M per WAR). That is not factoring in his recent injury history, his PED baggage, and the possibility he may not be playable in LF within a few years.
So you tell me, exactly how much surplus value does Braun have?
Just me, but I'm thrilled that Coppy's sticking to his guns personally. Most of the trade scenarios that have been mentioned strike me as far more "trading to be trading" deals to me. I get it, but the thought of "wasting" Julio's value on a bad team simply makes no sense whatsoever - the only way his value goes down (for quite some time honestly) is if he gets hurt or tanks. There's been no evidence that either of those things will happen in the near future.
Joc Pederson? Seriously? Pretty sure they're playing this as well as it can be played. Identify the exact pieces you need to fill long term holes - Bregman, Moncada, Benintendi, Gallo plus, Brinson plus - and set the price. If those teams aren't willing to meet that price, they don't want him. That's perfectly fine. Don't just give him away because it's a market that's soft on pitching - that only makes him MORE valuable. IF (a huge if) Gray or Sale were to suddenly become available, the asking price for either is going to be more than those players I mentioned. If Dombrowski won't pay one or the other of his guys for Julio, he's not going to pay BOTH to get those guys. Even if he did, that'd only help the asking price for Julio because it would eliminate them going forward.
As Enscheff mentioned, the days of needing to trade for quantity have passed. Sure, you want to keep stockpiling talent, but not 2, 3, or 4 "B" prospects for someone like Julio. If they were to "settle" for Gallo or Brinson I'd expect to get an arm or extra prospect back to help with that quantity. If you don't get a difference maker in any Julio deal, you've made a really bad trade.
Joc Pederson? Seriously? Pretty sure they're playing this as well as it can be played. Identify the exact pieces you need to fill long term holes - Bregman, Moncada, Benintendi, Gallo plus, Brinson plus - and set the price. If those teams aren't willing to meet that price, they don't want him. That's perfectly fine. Don't just give him away because it's a market that's soft on pitching - that only makes him MORE valuable. IF (a huge if) Gray or Sale were to suddenly become available, the asking price for either is going to be more than those players I mentioned. If Dombrowski won't pay one or the other of his guys for Julio, he's not going to pay BOTH to get those guys. Even if he did, that'd only help the asking price for Julio because it would eliminate them going forward.
As Enscheff mentioned, the days of needing to trade for quantity have passed. Sure, you want to keep stockpiling talent, but not 2, 3, or 4 "B" prospects for someone like Julio. If they were to "settle" for Gallo or Brinson I'd expect to get an arm or extra prospect back to help with that quantity. If you don't get a difference maker in any Julio deal, you've made a really bad trade.
Russ2dollas
10 yr, $185 million Extension
He's still a power bat. No way are you getting Lucroy for Jenkins. I'm not sure the Brewers take Braun for Jenkins.
Yes, considering he is on pace for his second consecutive sub-3 WAR season, is nothing special defensively, and can't hit LHers at all.
What else does Joc do besides hit 25 HRs? He isn't good defensively. He isn't good on the bases. He does walk at a decent clip, but his BA is so low it still results in a mediocre OBP. So why else is a team trying to acquire him?
Works both ways -
I'm not sure I'd trade them Jenkins for Braun if they didn't eat some of the $$$.
Tapate50
Well-known member
They probably don't take Braun for Jenkins. Much less toss in Lucroy as a party favor.
I've read some stuff on this board but that takes the cake. Thats a murph proposal bro.