TUESDAY THREAD FINAL 4/25 ... Most important day so far

striker42 said:
I just hope we don't give up on Newcomb and it become an Arrieta situation. Patience costs us nothing.
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Teams can't keep guys in the minors forever. At some point they must be given a chance at the MLB level, and a team in contention often can't afford to give a guy unlimited chances to "figure it out".

Arrieta wasn't good until 2014, and the Cubs were bad in 2013/2014, so they could afford to let him "figure it out". This is what the Braves should currently be doing rather than paying Dickey, Colon and Garcia $30M to give a non-contending team mediocre innings.

If the Braves are still awful by the time Newcomb is 28 like Arrieta was, the rebuild will have already failed miserably and there will be new Johns in the FO.
 
I agree about getting those young arms in there, but it's not a terrible idea to let the old guys take some lumps and try to sell them before throwing the new guys in. That way you can't pin a crappy season on the young pitchers you're trying out. Confidence and such can be pretty important to young athletes.
 
chipchildress said:
I agree about getting those young arms in there, but it's not a terrible idea to let the old guys take some lumps and try to sell them before throwing the new guys in. That way you can't pin a crappy season on the young pitchers you're trying out. Confidence and such can be pretty important to young athletes.
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The example we are currently discussing is Arrieta, who was not young when the Cubs gave him a chance at the MLB level. He was a disappointing prospect who the Cubs decided to take a chance on because they were terrible. The Braves should be doing the same thing in an attempt to find the next Arrieta, not paying old pitchers $30M to eat innings.
 
Wait. Swanson should be in AAA to learn to hit but pitchers should learn to pitch in the majors. Maybe they are just trying to keep Wisler's service time in check.
 
bravesfanMatt said:
Wait. Swanson should be in AAA to learn to hit but pitchers should learn to pitch in the majors. Maybe they are just trying to keep Wisler's service time in check.
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Unsurprisingly, you failed to comprehend what I wrote. I'll explain it for the 3rd time...

Arrieta was not a young pitcher when the Cubs acquired him. He was a 27 year old former 5th round pick that didn't pan out. The Cubs were going to be terrible, so they decided to give him a shot to see if they could figure things out because they identified something they like with him (probably velocity and spin rate). They ended up figuring things out, and the Cubs were rewarded with 16 WAR over 3 great seasons.

The Braves should be trying to find the next Arrieta, not paying stopgap pitchers $30M to eat innings in a noncompetitive season. I don't know which 27 year old the Braves should be giving these chances to, but I'm sure a little research could dig up some candidates.

Is there any chance you were able to wrap your head around the difference between Arrieta's situation and Wisler's situation? Or are you just going to keep proving how stupid you are?
 
So it is better to trade for 28 year old quad A guys in hopes to hit than to pay reliable pitching so you don't have to call up prospects too soon and that can be flipped if they pitch well. Brilliant.
 
bravesfanMatt said:
So it is better to trade for 28 year old quad A guys in hopes to hit than to pay reliable pitching so you don't have to call up prospects too soon and that can be flipped if they pitch well. Brilliant.
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If you think you can identify the next Arrieta, yes. The Braves aren't even trying. And you aren't taking issue with the idea, you simply didn't understand the difference between Arrieta's and Wisler's situations. You are THAT stupid.

You think there are only 2 options to eat innings at the MLB level? Pay mediocre veterans to eat innings, or rush young prospects?

The Braves could have very easily rolled the dice on a couple attempts at finding the next Arrieta, and if/when those guys failed called up a young guy who deserved a promotion or went with another filler guy like Collmenter. Essentially exactly what they are doing with Colon/Dickey/Garcia, but with a much better potential payoff. What are any of those 3 guys going to net the Braves? Another Ellis? Yay!

Your stupidity it amusing though, so thanks for that.
 
Enscheff said:
Unsurprisingly, you failed to comprehend what I wrote. I'll explain it for the 3rd time...

Arrieta was not a young pitcher when the Cubs acquired him. He was a 27 year old former 5th round pick that didn't pan out. The Cubs were going to be terrible, so they decided to give him a shot to see if they could figure things out because they identified something they like with him (probably velocity and spin rate). They ended up figuring things out, and the Cubs were rewarded with 16 WAR over 3 great seasons.

The Braves should be trying to find the next Arrieta, not paying stopgap pitchers $30M to eat innings in a noncompetitive season. I don't know which 27 year old the Braves should be giving these chances to, but I'm sure a little research could dig up some candidates.

Is there any chance you were able to wrap your head around the difference between Arrieta's situation and Wisler's situation? Or are you just going to keep proving how stupid you are?
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Didn't the cubs trade a stopgap (Feldman) to get Jake? Maybe the FO is hoping to trade our stopgaps for a high ceiling guy
 
How many jakes been 'found' since. Also the braves paid for reliability so they didn't have to
Call up someone deserving too soon. And like state said they could then trade said reliable pitching for that 'shot'.
 
msstate7 said:
Didn't the cubs trade a stopgap (Feldman) to get Jake? Maybe the FO is hoping to trade our stopgaps for a high ceiling guy
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They were definitely acquired with an eye towards flipping them, but when have we seen the Braves leverage the advantage of meaningless MLB innings like the Cubs did with Arrieta? Nothing the Braves have ever done tells me those veteran pitchers will be flipped for anything other than minor league organizational filler.

The closest we have seen the Braves come to "seeing what a guy can do" is Adonis Garcia, and in that case they couldn't even figure out that it's time to cut bait on the guy. Even when they do the right thing they can't quite get it right.
 
bravesfanMatt said:
How many jakes been 'found' since. Also the braves paid for reliability so they didn't have to
Call up someone deserving too soon. And like state said they could then trade said reliable pitching for that 'shot'.
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That doesn't change the fact that you didn't even understand my statement...because you're a moron.
 
Enscheff said:
If you think you can identify the next Arrieta, yes. The Braves aren't even trying. And you aren't taking issue with the idea, you simply didn't understand the difference between Arrieta's and Wisler's situations. You are THAT stupid.

You think there are only 2 options to eat innings at the MLB level? Pay mediocre veterans to eat innings, or rush young prospects?

The Braves could have very easily rolled the dice on a couple attempts at finding the next Arrieta, and if/when those guys failed called up a young guy who deserved a promotion or went with another filler guy like Collmenter. Essentially exactly what they are doing with Colon/Dickey/Garcia, but with a much better potential payoff. What are any of those 3 guys going to net the Braves? Another Ellis? Yay!

Your stupidity it amusing though, so thanks for that.
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you seem to be contradicting yourself here. you'd like the braves to turn newcomb into arrietta by being patient and allowing him to learn.

currently the braves are being patient with newcomb and letting him grow.

what's the big rush here? i'm sure he'll have plenty of chance to suck at the big league level in time. and to complete your story, then he'd finally be old enough and ready e enough to be arrietta. but this time he'd be under contract since the braves didn't waste early years on him only to watch him fail and ultimately get traded or quit.

instead they waited and let him learn his craft. then they let him work his craft in the big leagues as the braves got closer and closer. finally he breaks out just as the braves are back as world series contenders.

that's your wish. that's what they're doing. two months of garcia will not prevent newcomb from turning into arrietta. promise.
 
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