Viz and Teheran listed as top trade candidates

CJ9 said:
No one who isn't a Braves fan thinks they would do that. The Rangers wouldn't even trade Profar straight up for Teheran as of like a week ago. I hate to keep saying the same thing, but the trades being talked about here and in Bill Shanks' moronic article today are the kind of talks that make people mad when actual trade returns don't meet expectations.
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Actually I think most of the analysis here about what we should be seeking for Teheran and Vizcaino is reasonable. We are looking to win the trade, but not asking or Miller-type overpay.
 
CJ9 said:
No one who isn't a Braves fan thinks they would do that. The Rangers wouldn't even trade Profar straight up for Teheran as of like a week ago. I hate to keep saying the same thing, but the trades being talked about here and in Bill Shanks' moronic article today are the kind of talks that make people mad when actual trade returns don't meet expectations.
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Then don't trade him. I think he's absolutely worth Moncada and Benintendi by himself. He's excellent and is cheap.
 
clvclv said:
Personally think this is the most likely scenario - at least part of it. Allard, Jenkins, and Davidson or Acuna perhaps?
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There's no way I'm trading Allard or Acuna for Wil Myers I'm sorry. Had Myers not had an injury prone past and wrist problems I'd be for but not now I'd say Jenkins, Whalen, Davidson and Hursh/Cabrera
 
nsacpi said:
Actually I think most of the analysis here about what we should be seeking for Teheran and Vizcaino is reasonable. We are looking to win the trade, but not asking or Miller-type overpay.
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I disagree. I think a Miller-type overpay is exactly what it will take for Teheran. But remember that we're not only dangling him, but Viz and Norris for smaller returns.
 
rico43 said:
I disagree. I think a Miller-type overpay is exactly what it will take for Teheran. But remember that we're not only dangling him, but Viz and Norris for smaller returns.
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The way I see it, the discussion aren't here has been centered (and of course there are always outliers) around getting a package that would be the equivalent of Swanson plus one of Inciarte/Blair but not both.

Btw, the post you quoted and responded was my take on the discussion around here. Your response seems to be about what the front office is looking for. So we may be talking about two different things.
 
nsacpi said:
The way I see it, the discussion aren't here has been centered (and of course there are always outliers) around getting a package that would be the equivalent of Swanson plus one of Inciarte/Blair but not both.

Btw, the post you quoted and responded was my take on the discussion around here. Your response seems to be about what the front office is looking for. So we may be talking about two different things.
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I don't doubt it. It's surprising, because these threads never get confusing.
 
CJ9 said:
No one who isn't a Braves fan thinks they would do that. The Rangers wouldn't even trade Profar straight up for Teheran as of like a week ago. I hate to keep saying the same thing, but the trades being talked about here and in Bill Shanks' moronic article today are the kind of talks that make people mad when actual trade returns don't meet expectations.
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Which is exactly why I wouldn't trade him. I'd be more than happy to keep him - actually, I'd prefer to. I think we all understand the concerns and points that people who don't have ties to the organization (fans included) have. The thing is, you (not you personally, but numbers guys/Law/Rosenthal/whomever) can throw whatever statistics you want at me - he's an "Ace" in Atlanta, and I don't care who else sees or understands that.

I think the hardest thing for him to overcome to be as successful elsewhere can't possibly be measured - the change of scenery. If he's not traded, he has a chance to have his number up there at SunTrust Park when he retires. He's been a Brave since he was 16 years old - turning down more money from the Yankees. He accepted a well below-market deal when he signed his current extension, and I see no reason that he'd turn down "fair" money to remain with the organization after this deal is up and he's in his 30s. You can see how much he loves being part of the organization whether he's in the game, in the dugout, or being interviewed.

If there's ANY chance he maintains this level of production and this is who he really is - it's going to be here. This organization has always believed it's who he is, and not just JS and Bobby - even Wren wouldn't trade him for Peavy when we were still contenders.

I couldn't give two *hits whether other teams (or reporters or pundits) think he's an "Ace" - the Braves and I do, and I'd just as soon keep him and trade a bunch of the other arms for the pieces we need to help him and Freddie get us back to the playoffs.
 
Normally I think trading Teheran for cheaper assets would be the way to go but we are going to have a hard time spending all the cash with a weak free agent market.
 
CJ9 said:
No one who isn't a Braves fan thinks they would do that. The Rangers wouldn't even trade Profar straight up for Teheran as of like a week ago. I hate to keep saying the same thing, but the trades being talked about here and in Bill Shanks' moronic article today are the kind of talks that make people mad when actual trade returns don't meet expectations.
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Well i mean you dont trade Julio just to trade him.

It's not like we MUST trade him.

Keeping him isnt the end of the world.
 
KB21 said:
Here's the question. Which scenario is better for 2017 and beyond?

Pitching staff headlined by Julio and Folty with a line up of Albies, Swanson, Freeman, Ruiz, Inciarte, Smith, Flowers, and Markakis; or a pitching staff headlined by Folty and Wisler with a line up that has Albies, Swanson, Freeman, Moncada, Inciarte, Smith, Swihart, and Benintendi?

I know some are saying that is an overpay for Julio, but if Boston wants him, that's the kind of package it will take.
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The latter, but i dont see boston giving up that kind of package for him.

With how hes pitching, i dont see how they dont trade him for anything short of Moncada plus others.
 
Heyward said:
Well i mean you dont trade Julio just to trade him.

It's not like we MUST trade him.

Keeping him isnt the end of the world.
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I'm not saying that it is. I would prefer us trade him so that we can actually have some young, impact bats, but I won't be mad if we keep him. Some of the people expecting Moncada, Benintendi and more for Teheran and Vizcaino are just on another planet. If we do end up trading Teheran and get impact bats, I'm just saying people shouldn't be mad because the ultimate return wasn't the Moncada, Benintendi and more group.
 
rico43 said:
I disagree. I think a Miller-type overpay is exactly what it will take for Teheran. But remember that we're not only dangling him, but Viz and Norris for smaller returns.
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I saw we want a Ken Giles like return for Viz which is fair given hes under control for 3.5 years.
 
CJ9 said:
I'm not saying that it is. I would prefer us trade him so that we can actually have some young, impact bats, but I won't be mad if we keep him. Some of the people expecting Moncada, Benintendi and more for Teheran and Vizcaino are just on another planet. If we do end up trading Teheran and get impact bats, I'm just saying people shouldn't be mad because the ultimate return wasn't the Moncada, Benintendi and more group.
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I dont see us trading Julio unless we win the trade.

It's gonna have to be for a Miller like trade or more.
 
CJ9 said:
I'm not saying that it is. I would prefer us trade him so that we can actually have some young, impact bats, but I won't be mad if we keep him. Some of the people expecting Moncada, Benintendi and more for Teheran and Vizcaino are just on another planet. If we do end up trading Teheran and get impact bats, I'm just saying people shouldn't be mad because the ultimate return wasn't the Moncada, Benintendi and more group.
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Not really, Teheran will deliver between $70 and $100m in excess value over the remaining time on his contract. That is equal to a top 10 prospect and a top 30 prospect just to be even money. You add Vizzy and all of a sudden you are looking at another top 50 prospect at least. Plus desiring a slight overpay and that deal actually is fair value. Front offices know this, they don't want to pay it, but someone will cave eventually.

That doesn't mean I think we should trade him, I think he's worth more to us than to another team, but if we can get an overpay, it'd be tough to say no.
 
IslandBrave said:
KLaw says he can't see Sox trading Moncada and Benintendi for Teheran and Viz.
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See, that's fine. Then we don't do it. We could go for guys like Will Meyers then.

It's insane how simple this stuff is - it's all about supply and demand. That being said, I'd do A top pitching guy, Jenkins and Davison for Meyers.
 
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