Braves trade for Chris Sale - Grissom going to Red Sox (Extension through 26 at 18M)

thewupk said:
I think your safer play was Nola. By all accounts the Braves tried to get him but he went back to Philly.
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While Nola has had a nice career, his ERA has been mid 4.00s two of the last three years. He hardly looks dominant any more. The Phillies might rue the day they offered that contract.
 
Russ2dollas said:
I think we no longer need anything.

AA can just sit back and look for opportunities. If there is x million left he can offer it to someone who gets nervous late in free agency musical chairs and see if we get lucky.

I know you wanted 20 million but we have 10 and a great team for one year. Or you can sign with the royals.

We are just looking for ice on the cake now. I’d love another impact arm and or a rh of for a back up and dh insurance. But now only if they pick our number
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Backup LF RHH who can also play center. Duvall, Grichuk, Pillar.
 
The Chosen One said:
AA must have amazing faith in Snit that Snit will properly manage Sale’s workload to even make it to October on a healthy note.
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Snitker has been really good at managing pitcher workloads, if he even has a say. Knowing when to remove a pitcher before they’re ineffective is not the same thing.
 
CyYoung31 said:
Snitker has been really good at managing pitcher workloads, if he even has a say. Knowing when to remove a pitcher before they’re ineffective is not the same thing.
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do we not remember him using Iglesias 5 times in 6 days, then not at all for like two weeks. Then

there was a stretch this summer where he probably used Iglesias if I remember like 9 times in 11 days.

i do remember him saying in May, “if I use all my best guys whenever the game is close now, they won’t make it to October”, then proceeds to use Tonkin in NLDS in high leverage after a week of rest, and then a day off in between G1 and G2, another between G2 and G3.
 
There are stretches where Snit is mysteriously competent at managing the roster. I suspect those stretches occur when the FO makes a push to get specific information into his hands. I’d be shocked if that information doesn’t include specific instructions on how to handle Sale’s workload.
 
The Chosen One said:
do we not remember him using Iglesias 5 times in 6 days, then not at all for like two weeks. Then

there was a stretch this summer where he probably used Iglesias if I remember like 9 times in 11 days.

i do remember him saying in May, “if I use all my best guys whenever the game is close now, they won’t make it to October”, then proceeds to use Tonkin in NLDS in high leverage after a week of rest, and then a day off in between G1 and G2, another between G2 and G3.
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Our pitchers are never overworked at the end of the season. That and bullpen deployment are two different discussions.
 
Yeah, I don't have the world's highest opinion of Snitker, but I don't believe that he's an actual, factual stupid person. I don't think he's ignorant of Sale's age and injury history, and if Anthopolous sits down with him in spring training and says, "Look, Sale's fragile, we need him for the postseason, so take it easy on him during the regular season," I don't believe Snitker's just going to ignore him and send Sale out in the eighth inning of a July game against the Marlins with 115 pitches under his belt. I'm reasonably confident that he'll be able to broadly execute a Chris Sale preservation plan.
 
This talk of twitner not being dumb is comically funny. Listen to any presser and count the ‘really good’ you hear. Then you will change your opinion.

After that watch twit and count his naps in the dugout. Then know he believes no high leverage BP guy can be deployed prior to the 6th inning and that your best pen pitcher can only. I mean only pitch in the 9th. Even if the heart of the order is up in the 8th.

He has a ton of baseball knowledge. Just unfortunate that most is so old school and out of date at this point.
 
Jaw said:
This is my thought. Kelenic potentially fixes LF at a reasonable rate for the next few years. Sale potentially makes a difference for the next two playoff runs. Neither lock down a large chunk of payroll for the future.
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I think when you look at the realistic risk and limited ceiling on the old dudes and then understand you're paying market rate for multiple years that figure to decline making a one year cash commitment Kelenic and a one or two year commitment to somebody who is a top 15-20 starter when healthy makes a lot of sense.

Personally, I wouldn't necessarily expect to win a game started by Stroman in playoffs so why pay him 22m for maybe three years when he's a 5'7 fairly meh dude heading towards his mid 30s.

Heyward has rarely been very good so not sure how that's even a floor.

Verdugo ... ok, but that's more like a 3/4 OF.
 
MadduxFanII said:
Yeah, I don't have the world's highest opinion of Snitker, but I don't believe that he's an actual, factual stupid person. I don't think he's ignorant of Sale's age and injury history, and if Anthopolous sits down with him in spring training and says, "Look, Sale's fragile, we need him for the postseason, so take it easy on him during the regular season," I don't believe Snitker's just going to ignore him and send Sale out in the eighth inning of a July game against the Marlins with 115 pitches under his belt. I'm reasonably confident that he'll be able to broadly execute a Chris Sale preservation plan.
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He's probably going to give him a normal workload in games for the era we are in.

I'd say the front office might be involved in planning to get him extra rest, but I don't think they should put a 60 pitch cap on him or anything like that. Give him a normal workload and be very conservative with skipping him or putting him on DL.
 
I almost feel like best case scenario is Sale has an injury early in the season that keeps him out until mid August so he has enough time to get some starts in to be ready for October. I am cautiously optimistic that his best year in terms of health in the last 4 years was last year. Looking at his game logs I noticed he seemed to throw his FB a whole lot less when he came back late season from injury. He was throwing his FB over 50% of the time most of the year then his last 7 starts he is suddenly throwing it less than 40% of the time. Also he had a 110 and 111 pitch games back to back in mid May and was out injured 10 days later. I dont know who thought that was a good idea but they should probably be fired.
 
cajunrevenge said:
I almost feel like best case scenario is Sale has an injury early in the season that keeps him out until mid August so he has enough time to get some starts in to be ready for October. I am cautiously optimistic that his best year in terms of health in the last 4 years was last year. Looking at his game logs I noticed he seemed to throw his FB a whole lot less when he came back late season from injury. He was throwing his FB over 50% of the time most of the year then his last 7 starts he is suddenly throwing it less than 40% of the time. Also he had a 110 and 111 pitch games back to back in mid May and was out injured 10 days later. I dont know who thought that was a good idea but they should probably be fired.
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The extent of my pitching coach experience involves kids aged 9-10 in league ball, so take it for what it's worth, but it seems to me like a good plan for Sale (and Morton for that matter) would be something like this. Never throw a 100th pitch in a game, and skip a start every 5th or 6th time through the rotation, maybe with an IL stint for "dead arm" thrown in somewhere around late July/early August. You certainly don't want to overwork any of the starters, especially the older ones, but by the same token you don't want them to get completely out of their routine or lose conditioning either. I'm concerned that the idea of supposedly saving Sale for October might be taken to the extreme to the player and the team's detriment.
 
cajunrevenge said:
I almost feel like best case scenario is Sale has an injury early in the season that keeps him out until mid August so he has enough time to get some starts in to be ready for October. I am cautiously optimistic that his best year in terms of health in the last 4 years was last year. Looking at his game logs I noticed he seemed to throw his FB a whole lot less when he came back late season from injury. He was throwing his FB over 50% of the time most of the year then his last 7 starts he is suddenly throwing it less than 40% of the time. Also he had a 110 and 111 pitch games back to back in mid May and was out injured 10 days later. I dont know who thought that was a good idea but they should probably be fired.
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There’s a reason they are currently the worst team in the AL East, and it’s not because they are competently run from top to bottom.

Competent teams are monitoring velocity, spin rates, release points, location and 10 other measurables real time to determine when a pitcher is tired and/or needs extra rest. Hopefully the Braves are doing it during the game and Snit is using that data to make decisions.
 
I remember looking at an interview question for an MLB team that asked the candidate to analyze some data sets and draw some type of conclusion. I always suspected they were looking for a candidate who could pinpoint where in the data it revealed a pitcher was fatigued.
 
Enscheff said:
There’s a reason they are currently the worst team in the AL East, and it’s not because they are competently run from top to bottom.

Competent teams are monitoring velocity, spin rates, release points, location and 10 other measurables real time to determine when a pitcher is tired and/or needs extra rest. Hopefully the Braves are doing it during the game and Snit is using that data to make decisions.
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lol. Only thing twit knows about velocity, spin rate, and location was when the tilt a world came to the 1940 state fair.
 
GovClintonTyree said:
While Nola has had a nice career, his ERA has been mid 4.00s two of the last three years. He hardly looks dominant any more. The Phillies might rue the day they offered that contract.
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Nola is still a good pitcher and very durable. He is the safer play in that he would likely be a bigger contributor in the 2024 season. That said, Sale does seem to have a higher ceiling for when he does pitch and the Braves are all but gurnateed to be in the playoffs so it's not a bad gamble. If Sale is healthy and pitching in October it's a brillant move.
 
bravesfanMatt said:
lol. Only thing twit knows about velocity, spin rate, and location was when the tilt a world came to the 1940 state fair.
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Snit is a great lockerroom manager. And honestly that's a huge part of his job. He just needs to be micromanaged a bit for in game decisions. In Bobby's day it wasn't that big of a deal because nobody knew any better. But we have the information today to make optimal decisions.
 
thewupk said:
Snit is a great lockerroom manager. And honestly that's a huge part of his job. He just needs to be micromanaged a bit for in game decisions. In Bobby's day it wasn't that big of a deal because nobody knew any better. But we have the information today to make optimal decisions.
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Manager won’t cost the braves many losses. And his clubhouse presence probably negates his tactical stupidity enough to minimize that even more. So I agree he is fine until the playoffs. Then a bench coach or someone has to be in charge of game time decisions. Any games twit cost the team in Oct are to hard to recover from.

I think AA is really trying to twit proof this team as much as possible. A great pen is one area he can hide twit in Oct.
 
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