Second ('Third') Trump Presidency Thread

thethe said:
How about IQ - Does that exist?

And yes there is a big differnce in your Sweden example. One country has the ability to produce verifiable records and one doesn't.

I still wouldn't accept Muslims without an incredible amount of vetting - something tot he effect of whereabouts the last 20 years.
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Fine, put IQ in the mix. All of my previously asked questions apply to IQ as well - who administers the tests? Who takes them? People already in America on behalf of people in their origin countries? People in their origin countries? A mix of the two? What about people of multiple ethnicities? Do their scores get divided up on a percentage basis? How far back are the tests valid? 1st gen, 2nd, 10th? How frequently are they updated? Do we only care about median score? Mean? Does standard deviation matter? Once these matters are all sorted out, what then becomes the threshold to allow someone entry?

I think you misunderstood my Swede example. Both people in the example are born and raised in Sweden and have Swedish citizenship. But one person’s ethnicity is fully Swedish, while the other is Iranian. Are they evaluated equally? Does the Iranian-Swede get evaluated as a Swede (because he’s a Swedish citizen and that’s the country he was born, raised, and lived his whole life in), or as an Iranian (because that’s his ethnic makeup, even though he’s never been to Iran), or do you apply some sort of average of the two?

I’m just trying to work out what everyone means when they say they want to use “data” to come up with a country of origin screening, because it’s not obvious to me how that would work in practice.
 
acesfull86 said:
Fine, put IQ in the mix. All of my previously asked questions apply to IQ as well - who administers the tests? Who takes them? People already in America on behalf of people in their origin countries? People in their origin countries? A mix of the two? What about people of multiple ethnicities? Do their scores get divided up on a percentage basis? How far back are the tests valid? 1st gen, 2nd, 10th? How frequently are they updated? Do we only care about median score? Mean? Does standard deviation matter? Once these matters are all sorted out, what then becomes the threshold to allow someone entry?

I think you misunderstood my Swede example. Both people in the example are born and raised in Sweden and have Swedish citizenship. But one person’s ethnicity is fully Swedish, while the other is Iranian. Are they evaluated equally? Does the Iranian-Swede get evaluated as a Swede (because he’s a Swedish citizen and that’s the country he was born, raised, and lived his whole life in), or as an Iranian (because that’s his ethnic makeup, even though he’s never been to Iran), or do you apply some sort of average of the two?

I’m just trying to work out what everyone means when they say they want to use “data” to come up with a country of origin screening, because it’s not obvious to me how that would work in practice.
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The “data” is initial triage on areas we should even accept vetted migrants. In your example of Sweden the Iranian (not really Muslim example) has a higher likelihood of having a valid vetting process than an Iranian in Iran. Do you agree?

Absent of an infrastructure to facilitate proper vetting I would just not take anyone in. Those counties that don’t have reliable vetting are all low IQ areas. India as well which don’t have dummies but an incredibly corrupt system which we have seen already.
 
thethe said:
The “data” is initial triage on areas we should even accept vetted migrants. In your example of Sweden the Iranian (not really Muslim example) has a higher likelihood of having a valid vetting process than an Iranian in Iran. Do you agree?
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Yes I agree we could get better IQ data from Sweden than Iran. But we also have plenty of Swedes and Iranians living in the US that could potentially provide the data as well. Is your suggestion that other countries, not us, administer and report on the IQ of their populations? Or should we do both? And again, the populations of these countries are not homogeneous, so do they all get scores based on being a Swedish citizen, or based on their own ethnicity/ethnicities, or some kind of combination?
 
acesfull86 said:
Yes I agree we could get better IQ data from Sweden than Iran. But we also have plenty of Swedes and Iranians living in the US that could potentially provide the data as well. Is your suggestion that other countries, not us, administer and report on the IQ of their populations? Or should we do both? And again, the populations of these countries are not homogeneous, so do they all get scores based on being a Swedish citizen, or based on their own ethnicity/ethnicities, or some kind of combination?
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IQ can test can be easily administered by us. I'm simply speaking about a proper vetting infrastructure which doesn't exist anywhere outside of the western world and China/Japan/etc....

Your whole point is that we will improperly exclude people from the country. I'm ok with that because we would properly excluding 100X of that number.
 
thethe said:
IQ can test can be easily administered by us. I'm simply speaking about a proper vetting infrastructure which doesn't exist anywhere outside of the western world and China/Japan/etc....

Your whole point is that we will improperly exclude people from the country. I'm ok with that because we would properly excluding 100X of that number.
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That’s not my whole point, or even part of my point.

I’m simply trying to determine what the system actually looks like for those who say we should have a data driven country of origin screening process for immigration. What data, how is it collected, how is it applied, what are the standards, etc.

None of your replies have clarified that even a little bit.
 
acesfull86 said:
That’s not my whole point, or even part of my point.

I’m simply trying to determine what the system actually looks like for those who say we should have a data driven country of origin screening process for immigration. What data, how is it collected, how is it applied, what are the standards, etc.

None of your replies have clarified that even a little bit.
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It is your point because your point is that these diamonds exist all over the world and only a truly merit based system captures them.

I acknowledge there are very capable people even in the shitholes of Africa but I don't care because the risk of bringing in terrible people far outweighs the risk of bringing in a diamond.

Your desired system doesn't exist in the real world nor could it ever be created. Its another Libertarian pipe dream that doesn't exist.


But these questions are very easy to answer in say a country like Japan or Hungary. Vetting would be easy and thast the whole point.
 
thethe said:
But these questions are very easy to answer in say a country like Japan or Hungary. Vetting would be easy and thast the whole point.
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What is your actual proposed, data driven vetting system?

Feel free to re-read any of my previous posts this morning / last night as examples of questions trying to drill into what the system looks like.

A Hungarian wants to become an American …what actually happens next?
 
acesfull86 said:
What is your actual proposed, data driven vetting system?

Feel free to re-read any of my previous posts this morning / last night as examples of questions trying to drill into what the system looks like.

A Hungarian wants to become an American …what actually happens next?
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Oh - Its very easy.

We work with local authorities to see arrest&police records / family history / current occupation / Any intelligence of involvement in foreign militias etc...

If those check our extremely exclusive boxes then they can come but without any welfare benefits for the current generation that is coming over. There should be one final IQ test to ensure that we don't have any sub 100 people in the country. Don't have to be a genius but I'm not trying to flood our market with low skilled labor regardless of where they come from. Robots will do all that within 5 years.
 
Tell me how any of that is possible in Africa or the middle east? You want to rely on that?

Even India who is now known to issue bullshit degrees.
 
thethe said:
Oh - Its very easy.

We work with local authorities to see arrest&police records / family history / current occupation / Any intelligence of involvement in foreign militias etc...

If those check our extremely exclusive boxes then they can come but without any welfare benefits for the current generation that is coming over. There should be one final IQ test to ensure that we don't have any sub 100 people in the country. Don't have to be a genius but I'm not trying to flood our market with low skilled labor regardless of where they come from. Robots will do all that within 5 years.
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Ok then that sounds a hell of a lot like we’re vetting people based on their individual merits
 
acesfull86 said:
Let me remind you that 2021 thethe thought this was possible.
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2021 thethe never thought it was possible in Africa and hte Middle East.

Just cherry picking one comment when I can give you many others that reinforce what I'm saying now.


acesfull86 said:
Ok then that sounds a hell of a lot like we’re vetting people based on their individual merits
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After an initial layer of excluding whole swaths of areas whereby judging 'merit' is impossible.

But of course the best filter is to do it by races that are compatible with Western Society but that hurts peoples feelings.
 
acesfull86 said:
Is a black Hungarian considered a Hungarian or something else?
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Well a black Hungarian who has been in that country for a long period of time has a reliable vetting history. If this black Hungarian ends up being an all too typical sub 100 IQ I would not admit.
 
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