Braves trade Shreve and Carpenter for Manny Banuelos

clvclv said:
We've now cleared $22.8 million (Heyward and Justin) PLUS Uggla's $13 million (following the season), and added several international slots. That's roughly HALF of what early projections of what it's going to take to sign him were.

Anybody that doesn't believe we're "all-in" on him is kidding themselves.
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Those international slots are pretty irrelevant in regards to Moncada, right?

We have to blow past the cap to sign him and then face the penalty next year. I see the accumulation of slots as a hedge against not getting Moncada, so that we can acquire a lot of international guys.
 
zitothebrave said:
If Moncada is legit, you trade Tron. There would be a market for him.
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If you weren't going to say it, I was.

Moncada is a franchise talent.

But I don't even think he can play SS, not sure if c2c was being serious or not.

I also think he could get $100MM+.
 
Tanking isnt guaranteed like NBA, and other sports.

There isnt always going to be a Strasburg/Harper there at the top like the Nats were lucky to get back to back years.

thethe is right here.
 
Hawk said:
If you weren't going to say it, I was.

Moncada is a franchise talent.

But I don't even think he can play SS, not sure if c2c was being serious or not.

I also think he could get $100MM+.
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I was more curious as to if that's important to him in regards to what you said concerning playing time. I am pretty sure he's listed as a SS. But that's more likely similar to how every player in the history of HS baseball plays SS.
 
I dont know how much Moncada will cost but the Braves have the money for him, and have scouted him a TON this offseason.

Whether they outbid the big markets is a bigger question.

And the Markakis hate is crazy, i dont even like the signing but for 11 mil per in the way contracts are nowadays isnt bad. And tanking doesnt guarantee a thing in baseball.
 
chop2chip said:
Disagree. Simba is a keeper. I would have to be blown away to trade him. I wouldn't let Moncada push him out.

But it's a pointless debate since Moncada isn't a big league SS.
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In Moncada wants to sign to play SS, if the Braves determine he can do it and potentially be like a Tulo, then you trade Tron and you get a massive return because of his contract. I mean it's not like I'm saying dump him.
 
zitothebrave said:
In Moncada wants to sign to play SS, if the Braves determine he can do it and potentially be like a Tulo, then you trade Tron and you get a massive return because of his contract. I mean it's not like I'm saying dump him.
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Fair point.

I wouldn't say Moncada is Tulo since a huge part of Tulo is his defensive value and there are zero indications that he would be a good defensive short stop, but I think young Hanley would be a good comparison.

In general I agree now that I think about it.

Moncada + spects > simba + cash
 
I've no doubt we're in very, very deep on Moncada, but I'll believe we're capable of out-bidding the big markets (because ownership refuses to acknowledge that Atlanta is one of them) when it happens. I haven't seen much evidence that the front office is willing to give out the uncomfortable contracts that the best players demand.

Which, considering that big, uncomfortable contracts got Frank Wren fired, is pretty rational.
 
chop2chip said:
Fair point.

I wouldn't say Moncada is Tulo since a huge part of Tulo is his defensive value and there are zero indications that he would be a good defensive short stop, but I think young Hanley would be a good comparison.

In general I agree now that I think about it.

Moncada + spects > simba + cash
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Now that you have flip-flopped on Simmons we seem to disagree. Oh well. :)
 
MadduxFanII said:
I've no doubt we're in very, very deep on Moncada, but I'll believe we're capable of out-bidding the big markets (because ownership refuses to acknowledge that Atlanta is one of them) when it happens. I haven't seen much evidence that the front office is willing to give out the uncomfortable contracts that the best players demand.
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Same here, I'll believe it when and if I see it. :)
 
Been tough to keep up with this runaway thread!

My two cents: Shreve was nobody's prospect until he added a pitch and blossomed overnight. Carpenter was occasionally on the ragged edge of burnout and scared me to death much of last season. Glad to get a return on him.

As for Banuelos, I defer to Mariano Rivera:
Mariano Rivera, the greatest closer ever to step on a mound, called the fireballer the best pitching prospect he’s ever seen.
 
Braves1976 said:
I would argue that, whether you'd favor ManBan over Fried or Fried over ManBan, that this return for Shreve and Carpenter shows how much we misread things and misplayed the Justin Upton trade. Further, Hart himself pretty much said they did just that too according to a piece by Jeff Schultz of the AJC after the deal.
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We got more than just Fried for Upton. And the pieces we got back were indeed valuable, not just AAA fillers.
 
Are we collecting pitchers who are in the middle of or just came back from missing 2 years? I like betting on upside and I won't miss Carpenter. Bullpen could be really shaky this year though. From reading this board I doubt we ever have a lead anyways.
 
Carp said:
We got more than just Fried for Upton. And the pieces we got back were indeed valuable, not just AAA fillers.
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Are you thethe's echo? Whatever the case, see my and Dalyn's responses to him on this subject as this was already answered in multiple posts.
 
zitothebrave said:
If those type of guys weren't on the table for Jason or Justin, I doubt they are for Kimbrel. Teams usually are a little bit smarter than that. Usually.
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No doubt - just pointing out that making open-ended statements like "No one we could trade Kimbrel for would be more valuable to the 2017 team than Kimbrel himself." is a bit crazy.
 
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