Viz and Teheran listed as top trade candidates

[bravos4evr]

I think we should keep Julio for at least another two years, if not the entire contract. We should keep him, use him up then let him go in free agency where someone else can overpay for his decline years. Let's spend $$$$ on bats in free agency, the draft and internationally or use some of our farm arms to acquire them. I would love a huge return that would help us long term for him, but I don't see it happening. Keep him

 

[Heyward]

This is my fear. lets hold him to build around him, but don't do anything to get better. I am sorry, but Ozzie and Swanson are not going to save this offense. Hell, I am not sure they will be ready to start next year. We have no clue what the new CBA will be and there is no way Coppy is giving up draft picks for bats. Just don't see him doing that.

If we go into next year with Viz and JT and did nothing to improve the offense, then I am done with the defending FO and ready for a new regime.. For now, I assume they have a plan and I trust they will accomplish it. I have been pleased outside of a few gafs..

Trading him for a decent prospect is stupid.

Not saying we need a Herchel Walker type of return but unless teams wont give up a very good package, there's no reason to trade him.

I'm fine with trading him for the right return but if we dont get significant pieces back, whats wrong with keeping him?

 

[Heyward]

Look, plain and simple, Julio had got to go.

You don't give him away by any means, but there is no reason to have him on this team.

Same goes for Viz.

Julio would be the best or one of the top 2 pitchers available, plenty of teams would be calling and that drives the price up.

Viz will be the best RP available (as long as the Yankees don't sell).

We can and should sell both of them and continue the rebuild.

If teams give up a similar to return to say Hamels.

I think he was dealt for a #2, #3, #5 and two 20-30 prospects in the Rangers system.

Now if a team with a really good system offers close to that, yeah you consider it, but you dont trade him just for the sake of making a trade, thats stupid.

Same with Viz if a team offers something good.

 

[bravesfanMatt]

Trading him for a decent prospect is stupid.

Not saying we need a Herchel Walker type of return but unless teams wont give up a very good package, there's no reason to trade him.

I'm fine with trading him for the right return but if we dont get significant pieces back, whats wrong with keeping him?

Nothing is wrong with keeping him. But they need to have two plans laid out. One how to improve team with him and how to improve without him.

 

[Heyward]

Nothing is wrong with keeping him. But they need to have two plans laid out. One how to improve team with him and how to improve without him.

Again i have no problem with trading him if a team wants to empty the farm system for him.

But trading him for a couple decent prospects is stupid.

 

[clvclv]

Teams aren't constricted to only getting pitchers from 'sellers'. They have more options in the off-season to fix holes in the rotation and the lineup.

My question's not limited to "sellers". Name a better option that might be available this winter.

 

[smootness]

Again i have no problem with trading him if a team wants to empty the farm system for him.

But trading him for a couple decent prospects is stupid.

Who has suggested trading him for just a couple decent prospects? Everyone who says we need to trade him is doing so under the assumption that when we do, we will get a very good return.

 

[Heyward]

Who has suggested trading him for just a couple decent prospects? Everyone who says we need to trade him is doing so under the assumption that when we do, we will get a very good return.

I've seen some who want to trade him for whatever we can get just so his value doesnt plummet.

But what if he keeps this up all year for the most part, then imagine the haul we can get this winter. Current FA SP are awful.

 

[bravesfanMatt]

I've seen some who want to trade him for whatever we can get just so his value doesnt plummet.

But what if he keeps this up all year for the most part, then imagine the haul we can get this winter. Current FA SP are awful.

I haven't said that we should trade him to trade him. We can win a trade and be closer to compete seriously than if we keep him. I just don't see how we ca price together a team. Maybe we trade prospects. But I don't want to rush this just for ticket sales.

 

[smootness]

I've seen some who want to trade him for whatever we can get just so his value doesnt plummet.

There is not one person on this board who has said that or even suggested it.

 

[Pugfan]

I think you are talking in circles..

you can't say you care more about pitching and then also say that OUR pitching is terrible. Julio is 1/5 of our staff and if our current staff is 100 losses, then JT is not going to move the needle enough to make a difference. So you are happy with keeping JT and wining 70 to 75 games and have no offensive pieces to build on while our young pitching develops. Or would you rather win 60 - 65 games without JT but have young pitching and young hitting to build upon?!?

I'm a big Julio Teheran fan. I don't want to trade him for more prospects. I don't want to keep trading our players and be the National League version of the Oakland freeking A's. We would have nothing but 4th and 5th starters if we traded Julio. The Mets and Nationals 4th starters would be our ace, lol.

 

[bravesfanMatt]

I'm a big Julio Teheran fan. I don't want to trade him for more prospects. I don't want to keep trading our players and be the National League version of the Oakland freeking A's. We would have nothing but 4th and 5th starters if we traded Julio. The Mets and Nationals 4th starters would be our ace, lol.

I understand. But I don't think our staff is that bad. Just young.

 

[Pugfan]

I understand. But I don't think our staff is that bad. Just young.

It's not good that's for sure
Wisler has a 4.47 FIP needs to improve K/9 and cut down on the fly balls. Looks like a 4th starter with a 50% chance to be a number 3.
Folty has a 4.72 FIP really needs to cut down on the homers/9. Very similar to the homerun derby pitcher Mike Minor
Blair has been really really bad. Jo Jo Reyes bad.
Perez is Horrible ratio's 2.0. can't strike anybody out. Crap
Gant looks like he could solid. But too early to tell
Newcomb who knows?

 

[smootness]

It's not good that's for sure
Wisler has a 4.47 FIP needs to improve K/9 and cut down on the fly balls. Looks like a 4th starter with a 50% chance to be a number 3.
Folty has a 4.72 FIP really needs to cut down on the homers/9. Very similar to the homerun derby pitcher Mike Minor
Blair has been really really bad. Jo Jo Reyes bad.
Perez is Horrible ratio's 2.0. can't strike anybody out. Crap
Gant looks like he could solid. But too early to tell
Newcomb who knows?

It's too bad players are destined to be what they currently are and never possibly anything more. Can you imagine if Mike Trout had lived up to his prospect billing instead of the sub-.700 OPS player he is?

 

[Pugfan]

It's too bad players are destined to be what they currently are and never possibly anything more. Can you imagine if Mike Trout had lived up to his prospect billing instead of the sub-.700 OPS player he is?

I'm not saying they can't get better. I like Folty, Gant and Newcomb. Wisler is pretty average and Blair looks like So-So Reyes Jr. The point is Teheran is the only good pitcher we have now. If the Braves trade him the rotation would look worse than the deadly Rick Mahler & Zane Smith staffs back in the mid 80's. With much more upside but the bust ratio for pitchers is really high.

 

[JohnAdcox]

Not saying we need a Herchel Walker type of return but unless teams wont give up a very good package, there's no reason to trade him.

Can Herchel catch or play LF?

 

[smootness]

I'm not saying they can't get better. I like Folty, Gant and Newcomb. Wisler is pretty average and Blair looks like So-So Reyes Jr. The point is Teheran is the only good pitcher we have now. If the Braves trade him the rotation would look worse than the deadly Rick Mahler & Zane Smith staffs back in the mid 80's. With much more upside but the bust ratio for pitchers is really high.

This is a fair point. I fully understand wanting to keep Teheran. There is definitely a large part of me that would like to keep him and would worry about our pitching without him. Having said that, there's also part of me that worries if we keep him, he either regresses, gets injured, or both. Injuries are a risk for anyone but especially so for pitchers.

And the bottom line is, we are loaded with future pitching talent (NOT, I repeat, NOT a surplus! Do not read this as me thinking we have a surplus!) and are not quite so loaded in legitimate bats. So Teheran represents our best option currently to go get some legitimate bats. It would certainly hurt our staff, but that's what you have to do sometimes.

I'm ok with whatever we decide, assuming that if we trade him it's for a really good haul. I like Teheran and would love to have him anchor our rotation during the transition, and I would also be more than ok with adding some bats that can be ready fairly soon. It's not an easy decision, but it could propel the rebuild forward even further.

 

[Pugfan]

This is a fair point. I fully understand wanting to keep Teheran. There is definitely a large part of me that would like to keep him and would worry about our pitching without him. Having said that, there's also part of me that worries if we keep him, he either regresses, gets injured, or both. Injuries are a risk for anyone but especially so for pitchers.

And the bottom line is, we are loaded with future pitching talent (NOT, I repeat, NOT a surplus! Do not read this as me thinking we have a surplus!) and are not quite so loaded in legitimate bats. So Teheran represents our best option currently to go get some legitimate bats. It would certainly hurt our staff, but that's what you have to do sometimes.

I'm ok with whatever we decide, assuming that if we trade him it's for a really good haul. I like Teheran and would love to have him anchor our rotation during the transition, and I would also be more than ok with adding some bats that can be ready fairly soon. It's not an easy decision, but it could propel the rebuild forward even further.

To compete with the Mets and Nationals we need very good pitchers like Teheran. What if we trade him for a good hitting prospect and he ends up like Andy Marte? When was the last starter we had that was durable and didn't have an elbow made of glass? All our previous good pitchers had Dr. James Andrews on speed dial. Plus his contract is very team friendly.

 

[smootness]

To compete with the Mets and Nationals we need very good pitchers like Teheran. What if we trade him for a good hitting prospect and he ends up like Andy Marte? When was the last starter we had that was durable and didn't have an elbow made of glass? All our previous good pitchers had Dr. James Andrews on speed dial. Plus his contract is very team friendly.

We have very good pitching talent in the pipeline. Yes, Teheran is the only proven guy, so it would sting to lose him. But it could definitely be worth it. I think that's all anybody is saying.

What if we don't trade him for Benintendi/Devers, they end up being studs, and Teheran blows his elbow out? Hypotheticals are worthless.

 

[Enscheff]

Albies and Swanson both just had a great game the first time they played together last night. Maybe they are both ready to take over at SS and 2B next year with a full 3 months together in AA.

Maybe the Braves sign Cespedes for 5/110 to take over in LF.

Maybe they sign Desmond for 4/70 to play 3B.

Maybe they sign Jason Castro for 3/30 to platoon with Flowers.

Maybe Norris keeps being a ~4.00 ERA guy and they resign him for 2/25 with a 3rd year option to fill the #4 slot in the rotation.

Maybe the Braves run out a lineup consisting of Castro/Flowers, Freeman, Albies, Swanson, Desmond, Cespedes, Mallex and Inciarte/Markakis, with a rotation of Teheran, Wisler, Folty, Norris and a young guy, and a bench with d'Arnaud, Jace and Frenchy on it.

If all that happens the Braves should keep Teheran and try to get better starting next year. That team can push for .500 in 2017, and is young enough that it can be even better in 2018.

If they are not willing to fully commit to a plan like that, then they MUST capitalize on Teheran's sky-high trade value and get some premium hitting prospects into the organization. t all depends on the goals for 2017, and they must not try to straddle the compete/rebuild line.