Braves sign Mac Attack, 1 yr 2 million deal

Russ2dollas said:
Interesting to me aa brings back Donaldson who he knew well but no on grandal.

Wonder if the draft pick is a big deal and they want one more year to go big in the draft.

To me this is punting catcher on offense. If that’s the case we can’t have dansby and inciarte.
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"Punting" Catcher like Flow/Zook over the last two years???

Better framer, better fit than Zook as a LHH, if Mac's 2018 really was because of injury you just upgraded the position for $2 million.

Steamer projections for Mac are 75 games, 11 HR, 1.2 WAR. For what he's getting paid with his framing and replacement of Markakis' veteran presence, I'll take that all day for that price - and it has nothing to do with being an old-timer.
 
I thought the Braves were gonna trade for Realmuto but for whatever reason, Miami doesnt wanna trade him within the division. Oh well, they can get fleeced like they did for Yelich and get a lesser return.
 
clvclv said:
"Punting" Catcher like Flow/Zook over the last two years???


Better framer, better fit than Zook as a LHH, if Mac's 2018 really was because of injury you just upgraded the position for $2 million.

Steamer projections for Mac are 75 games, 11 HR, 1.2 WAR. For what he's getting paid with his framing and replacement of Markakis' veteran presence, I'll take that all day for that price - and it has nothing to do with being an old-timer.
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I said on offense.

I know catcher is bad . I don’t think we can win the ws with 3 sub avg reagulars in the line up and non dominant pitching
 
Adding Mac here is a nice move. We've got a good catching prospect, so no real reason to sign a long term guy or make a major trade.
 
Russ2dollas said:
I said on offense.

I know catcher is bad . I don’t think we can win the ws with 3 sub avg reagulars in the line up and non dominant pitching
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The 2018 Braves finished 11th in runs scored from Catchers.

The 2018 Braves finished 10th in hits from Catchers.

The 2018 Braves finished 7th in 2Bs from Catchers.

The 2018 Braves finished 10th in HRs from Catchers.

The 2018 Braves finished 9th in total bases from Catchers.

The 2018 Braves finished 9th in RBIs from Catchers.

The 2018 Braves finished 8th in OBP for Catchers.

The 2018 Braves finished 9th in OPS for Catchers.


That's not exactly "punting" anything. If Mac meets his relatively modest Steamer projections, there's little reason not to expect similar production from the position in 2019, and he'll mean WORLDS more to the pitching staff than Zook ever imagined meaning.

No, he's not going to put up the kind of offensive numbers Realmuto, Grandal, and Ramos likely will - but the Braves don't need him to. Like it or not, he's an upgrade over Zook for a lot less money, and signing him for $2 million may very well allow AA to still add Brantley or McCutchen. Adding Donaldson, Brantley/McCutchen, and Mac makes this team FAR BETTER than adding Realmuto/Grandal/Ramos and Brantley/McCutchen would have.
 
I don't mind it. We have a veteran tandem in place at a low cost who can effectively frame pitches and also handle our young staff.
 
Russ2dollas said:
To me this is punting catcher on offense. If that’s the case we can’t have dansby and inciarte.
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Agreed. I like McCann alot, and I'm in favor of prioritizing defense at catcher to help the young pitchers. I also think it's unreasonable to expect McCann and Flowers to produce at the same offensive level Suzuki and Flowers have the past couple of years.

Even if they are able to improve on Markakis's production from last year the lineup just got shorter. One of SS/CF/C needs an offensive upgrade. CF seems like the easiest spot due to Acuna's ability to play there and the abundance of mediocre and inexpensive cOF options.
 
Jaw said:
Agreed. I like McCann alot, and I'm in favor of prioritizing defense at catcher to help the young pitchers. I also think it's unreasonable to expect McCann and Flowers to produce at the same offensive level Suzuki and Flowers have the past couple of years.

Even if they are able to improve on Markakis's production from last year the lineup just got shorter. One of SS/CF/C needs an offensive upgrade. CF seems like the easiest spot due to Acuna's ability to play there and the abundance of mediocre and inexpensive cOF options.
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Are they punting SS and CF? Ender isnt Trout but he's not a black hole. Dansby can be a black hole but he's improved at the plate. You can do a lot worse than them. I do wish we got a better offensive catcher though.

I'd have to think we look to get a better corner outfielder now. Next move on AA's checklist.
 
clvclv said:
The 2018 Braves finished 11th in runs scored from Catchers.

The 2018 Braves finished 10th in hits from Catchers.

The 2018 Braves finished 7th in 2Bs from Catchers.

The 2018 Braves finished 10th in HRs from Catchers.

The 2018 Braves finished 9th in total bases from Catchers.

The 2018 Braves finished 9th in RBIs from Catchers.

The 2018 Braves finished 8th in OBP for Catchers.

The 2018 Braves finished 9th in OPS for Catchers.


That's not exactly "punting" anything. If Mac meets his relatively modest Steamer projections, there's little reason not to expect similar production from the position in 2019, and he'll mean WORLDS more to the pitching staff than Zook ever imagined meaning.

No, he's not going to put up the kind of offensive numbers Realmuto, Grandal, and Ramos likely will - but the Braves don't need him to. Like it or not, he's an upgrade over Zook for a lot less money, and signing him for $2 million may very well allow AA to still add Brantley or McCutchen. Adding Donaldson, Brantley/McCutchen, and Mac makes this team FAR BETTER than adding Realmuto/Grandal/Ramos and Brantley/McCutchen would have.
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I don't care about stats for catchers. Catchers suck.

I'll try again. Maybe I don't communicate well or maybe you don't read well.

I do not think you can have 3 sub average hitters in your lineup as a national league team with avg pitching. If you are the Mets, that might work.

I expect Dansby, Catcher and Inciarte to be a 80-100 wrc+ output. That is 1/3 of the line up. Then we have a pitcher batting. I don't think that's what you if you are going to win in now.

I think if we want to be successful we need to only have 1 position where we think 100 wrc+ is the ceiling. That is said in the context of not losing all of the value on D. I'm not advocating for all offense and no D. But I think we'd do better 115 wrc+ and solid D then 90 wrc+ and elite D.

Most of the league is getting nothing offensively from catcher. I get that. I like that our catchers are cheap. I especially like being cheap at C because they break down faster. I was never pro realmuto trade.
 
Jaw said:
Agreed. I like McCann alot, and I'm in favor of prioritizing defense at catcher to help the young pitchers. I also think it's unreasonable to expect McCann and Flowers to produce at the same offensive level Suzuki and Flowers have the past couple of years.

Even if they are able to improve on Markakis's production from last year the lineup just got shorter. One of SS/CF/C needs an offensive upgrade. CF seems like the easiest spot due to Acuna's ability to play there and the abundance of mediocre and inexpensive cOF options.
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I think Acuna can play CF and play it well. Most scouts I read felt the same. I don't think the defensive metrics agree. I do think it's the best place to make our upgrade and Inciarte should be a very valuable deal.

Maybe you can find a way to get a good OF who truely rakes LH. What we tried to do with Duvall but someone who can hit LH much better and maybe not an elite defender. Inciarte vs RH is what, 110 wrc+? I'm not sure. Maybe if Inciarte plays only vs RH we can get he production I'm asking for and we can keep his elite D and elite contract.

Is there a guy that hits LH like Matt Diaz without playing defense like Matt Diaz?
 
Russ2dollas said:
I said on offense.

I know catcher is bad . I don’t think we can win the ws with 3 sub avg reagulars in the line up and non dominant pitching
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Flowers isn't sub average for a catcher and if Mac can bounce back, he isn't either. Considering both there ages, it's a risk for sure, but both have a good track record. And if both players only repeated their 2018 numbers, we've have a combined 1.6 WAR from the catcher position, with 15 homers and an OBP over .300. That isn't exactly terrible.
 
Carp said:
Flowers isn't sub average for a catcher and if Mac can bounce back, he isn't either. Considering both there ages, it's a risk for sure, but both have a good track record. And if both players only repeated their 2018 numbers, we've have a combined 1.6 WAR from the catcher position, with 15 homers and an OBP over .300. That isn't exactly terrible.
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again....stop comparing him to catcher. I get that.

There are only 25 men on the team. Only 9 folks allowed to play at one time. Having 4/9 hitters in your line up being worse than league average is not good. You are going to have to hope for some sequencing luck.
 
We can use better hitting at catcher but Ender's pretty solid for your 6th best offensive option. Braves dont have a Yankees/Sox/Dodgers payroll so it is what it is. Besides, you can do alot worse than Ender. Regarding Dansby, i mentioned before if he keeps struggling with the bat, you can just move Camargo to short, yes your defense gets worse, but offensively you're better.
 
Russ2dollas said:
again....stop comparing him to catcher. I get that.

There are only 25 men on the team. Only 9 folks allowed to play at one time. Having 4/9 hitters in your line up being worse than league average is not good. You are going to have to hope for some sequencing luck.
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How do you "stop comparing him to Catcher"???

You said it yourself - 25 men on a team - 9 play at a time. One of those HAS TO be a Catcher on every team.

If (as you say) Catchers suck and every team has to play them, having a tandem that's Top 10 in the league is pretty good.

Let me rephrase those earlier rankings to make things more clear...


The 2018 Braves finished 11th in runs scored from Catchers.

The 2018 Braves finished 10th in hits from Catchers. 6 more than the Dodgers' tandem with "stud" Grandal, ahead of the Yankees' tandem including "stud" Sanchez, Cubs' tandem with "stud" Contreras, Cardinals' tandem with "stud" Yadi, and Royals' tandem with "stud" Salvy. Boston won it all and finished dead last in this category.

The 2018 Braves finished 7th in 2Bs from Catchers. 4 more than the Dodgers' tandem with "stud" Grandal, tied with the Royals' tandem including "stud" Salvy, and ahead of the Yankees' tandem including "stud" Sanchez, Cubs' tandem with "stud" Contreras, Cardinals' tandem with "stud" Yadi. Boston won it all and finished 23rd in this category.

The 2018 Braves finished 10th in HRs from Catchers. Boston won it all and finished 28th in this category.

The 2018 Braves finished 9th in total bases from Catchers. Ahead of the Cubs' tandem with "stud" Contreras and Royals tandem with "stud" Salvy. Boston won it all and finished dead last in this category.

The 2018 Braves finished 9th in RBIs from Catchers. 5 RBIs behind the Dodgers' tandem with "stud" Grandal, and ahead of the Cubs' tandem with "stud" Contreras. Boston won it all and finished 29th in this category.

The 2018 Braves finished 8th in OBP for Catchers. Ahead of the Marlins' tandem including "stud" Realmuto, Yankees' tandem including "stud" Sanchez, Cubs' tandem with "stud" Contreras, Cardinals' tandem with "stud" Yadi, and Royals' tandem with "stud" Salvy. Boston won it all and finished dead last in this category.

The 2018 Braves finished 9th in OPS for Catchers. Ahead of the Yankees' tandem including "stud" Sanchez, Cubs' tandem with "stud" Contreras, Cardinals' tandem with "stud" Yadi, and Royals' tandem with "stud" Salvy. Boston won it all and finished dead last in this category.


Would it be nice to have a little more pop? Sure. Other than that, the pairing of Flow and Mac ought to measure up to everybody else, and it certainly won't be considered a "black hole" when compared with just about everyone else at that position. It's also not going to hurt moving them further down in the order where they won't need to be relied on for offense with Acuna, Albies, Freeman, Donaldson, and a Markakis upgrade, hitting in front of them and carrying most of the heavy load.

The hope is that Ender will be a little better than in 2018, Dansby will be a little better than in 2018, and using Camargo all over the place will keep everyone fresher and enable them to perform at a higher clip than they did as well.
 
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Russ2dollas said:
again....stop comparing him to catcher. I get that.

There are only 25 men on the team. Only 9 folks allowed to play at one time. Having 4/9 hitters in your line up being worse than league average is not good. You are going to have to hope for some sequencing luck.
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Every team has to compromise somewhere. No one has an above hitter and fielder at every position. 2 of the 4 are elite defenders and about league average hitters (or slightly below). Catcher has a decent chance to both as well, given Flowers' and Mac's history.

And we should be comparing him to other catchers. It's historically difficult to find catchers who are also overall above average hitters. So comparing him to other catchers is all we can do.
 
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clvclv said:
How do you "stop comparing him to Catcher"???

You said it yourself - 25 men on a team - 9 play at a time. One of those HAS TO be a Catcher on every team.

If (as you say) Catchers suck and every team has to play them, having a tandem that's Top 10 in the league is pretty good.

Let me rephrase those earlier rankings to make things more clear...


The 2018 Braves finished 11th in runs scored from Catchers.

The 2018 Braves finished 10th in hits from Catchers. 6 more than the Dodgers' tandem with "stud" Grandal, ahead of the Yankees' tandem including "stud" Sanchez, Cubs' tandem with "stud" Contreras, Cardinals' tandem with "stud" Yadi, and Royals' tandem with "stud" Salvy. Boston won it all and finished dead last in this category.

The 2018 Braves finished 7th in 2Bs from Catchers. 4 more than the Dodgers' tandem with "stud" Grandal, tied with the Royals' tandem including "stud" Salvy, and ahead of the Yankees' tandem including "stud" Sanchez, Cubs' tandem with "stud" Contreras, Cardinals' tandem with "stud" Yadi. Boston won it all and finished 23rd in this category.

The 2018 Braves finished 10th in HRs from Catchers. Boston won it all and finished 28th in this category.

The 2018 Braves finished 9th in total bases from Catchers. Ahead of the Cubs' tandem with "stud" Contreras and Royals tandem with "stud" Salvy. Boston won it all and finished dead last in this category.

The 2018 Braves finished 9th in RBIs from Catchers. 5 RBIs behind the Dodgers' tandem with "stud" Grandal, and ahead of the Cubs' tandem with "stud" Contreras. Boston won it all and finished 29th in this category.

The 2018 Braves finished 8th in OBP for Catchers. Ahead of the Marlins' tandem including "stud" Realmuto, Yankees' tandem including "stud" Sanchez, Cubs' tandem with "stud" Contreras, Cardinals' tandem with "stud" Yadi, and Royals' tandem with "stud" Salvy. Boston won it all and finished dead last in this category.

The 2018 Braves finished 9th in OPS for Catchers. Ahead of the Yankees' tandem including "stud" Sanchez, Cubs' tandem with "stud" Contreras, Cardinals' tandem with "stud" Yadi, and Royals' tandem with "stud" Salvy. Boston won it all and finished dead last in this category.


Would it be nice to have a little more pop? Sure. Other than that, the pairing of Flow and Mac ought to measure up to everybody else, and it certainly won't be considered a "black hole" when compared with just about everyone else at that position. It's also not going to hurt moving them further down in the order where they won't need to be relied on for offense with Acuna, Albies, Freeman, Donaldson, and a Markakis upgrade, hitting in front of them and carrying most of the heavy load.

The hope is that Ender will be a little better than in 2018, Dansby will be a little better than in 2018, and using Camargo all over the place will keep everyone fresher and enable them to perform at a higher clip than they did as well.
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Rating catchers based on Runs, Hits and RBI....classic derrrrpppppp!
 
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