Braves sign Donaldson, 1 yr 23 million deal.

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Could AA fill the "holes" while keeping the top 8 prospects plus Contreras?

Wilson and Wentz or Muller for Joc Pederson? Opens a spot in LA for Verdugo. Now that there's a RH thumper behind Freddie (and you've bought the extra time for Riley to take over that role in 2020), a Pederson/Duvall platoon behind Donaldson (and Riley) for the next two years might not be bad at all and would keep the lineup balanced - Acuna, Ozzie, Freddie, Donaldson, Pederson, Mac, Ender, Dansby would be pretty strong against RHPs, and Acuna (CF), Ozzie, Freddie, Donaldson, Camargo (RF), Flowers, Duvall, Dansby could be pretty potent against LHPs.

He's certainly not the Ace everyone dreams of, but if Bumgarner could be had for Fried and Allard he might be worth the gamble for one year considering we'd still have Folty, Newk, Gausman, Touki, Soroka, Gohara, Wright, and Anderson. If he bounces back and pitches better, you could consider using Teheran's money to try to re-sign him in 2020 - if not, he at least buys you one more year of development for your other top arms. One could easily argue that the same thing could be accomplished by simply re-signing Anibal, but come playoff time I'd think Bumgarner would cause more teams a little more uneasiness if he's healthy.

As mentioned so many times AA needs to move some of these arms, but it'd sure be nice to move the lesser ones while upgrading the roster even if it's for a shorter term. By the time Pederson and Duvall can walk, you'll have Pache (and possibly Waters) ready, and you'll still have all the top pitching prospects if/when Bumgarner, Julio, and Gausman walk.

Adding Bumgarner and Pederson ought to leave AA with enough money to add an arm at the back-end as well.
 
I think we open the season with Acuna batting leadoff.

Albies is actually the hardest among our hitters to figure out where to bat. He will likely be among our four best hitters, but his OBP sux and he makes way too many unproductive outs. I guess that sums up a #5 hitter, but it seems so weird to have such a tiny fast guy batting 5th.
 
I wonder in the history of baseball, how many times a #5 hitter has led a team in stolen bases? (not that Albies will do that, but you get the idea)
 
TheRunningAgent said:
I think Allard and Fried is too much for one year of Bumgarner. Just my O.
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It certainly is a bit steep, no question, and you're right - they may be trying to get more, which is why they're fishing now instead of waiting until the deadline.

The reasoning behind that kind of offer is two-fold...

1.) It's more than enough to get him based on the precious value charts.

And more importantly...

2.) It's likely enough of an overpay (with pieces you don't expect to be part of your long-term plan) to convince the Giants to move him NOW rather than waiting until June/July when there may be other suitors.

Always funny to hear certain people scream about how much "value" someone like Max Fried has, and in the same breath admit that the Braves have nowhere to use him. At this point, there's very little chance he's EVER going to be part of the Braves' rotation. That doesn't mean he's "useless" - far from it - but if you're going to make the argument about how "useful" a lesser Pitcher like Freeman is and you're interested in keeping that "useful" guy for an extra million dollars more than it would cost to put Fried in the pen, why not cash in on Fried's "value" by upgrading the big club in another way???

Another reason for this type of deal - you continue to offset the international penalties by offering QOs to Donaldson and Bumgarner, adding two high picks in the 2020 draft - spend those picks on arms that are farther away than guys you're not going to use like Fried and Allard and there's not this huge hole in the pipeline 3-4 years from now.

There's almost NO CHANCE Fried starts or closes a playoff game while he's in Atlanta (and the same can be said for Allard), so why not capitalize on his "value" and trade him for someone who might - especially if you're going to pay Sam Freeman $1.5 million this year while you waste another year of Fried's health in Gwinnett's pen?

Simple difference between thinking you can do everything based on the numbers the computer spits out and knowing you can't - ask Dave Roberts and the Dodgers or anyone ever associated with the Rays how that works out. Of course, they're so busy polishing all their World Series trophies they may not have time to answer.
 
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clvclv said:
It certainly is a bit steep, no question, and you're right - they may be trying to get more, which is why they're fishing now instead of waiting until the deadline.

The reasoning behind that kind of offer is two-fold...

1.) It's more than enough to get him based on the precious value charts.

And more importantly...

2.) It's likely enough of an overpay (with pieces you don't expect to be part of your long-term plan) to convince the Giants to move him NOW rather than waiting until June/July when there may be other suitors.

Always funny to hear certain people scream about how much "value" someone like Max Fried has, and in the same breath admit that the Braves have nowhere to use him. At this point, there's very little chance he's EVER going to be part of the Braves' rotation. That doesn't mean he's "useless" - far from it - but if you're going to make the argument about how "useful" a lesser Pitcher like Freeman is and you're interested in keeping that "useful" guy for an extra million dollars more than it would cost to put Fried in the pen, why not cash in on Fried's "value" by upgrading the big club in another way???

Another reason for this type of deal - you continue to offset the international penalties by offering QOs to Donaldson and Bumgarner, adding two high picks in the 2020 draft - spend those picks on arms that are farther away than guys you're not going to use like Fried and Allard and there's not this huge hole in the pipeline 3-4 years from now.

There's almost NO CHANCE Fried starts or closes a playoff game while he's in Atlanta (and the same can be said for Allard), so why not capitalize on his "value" and trade him for someone who might - especially if you're going to pay Sam Freeman $1.5 million this year while you waste another year of Fried's health in Gwinnett's pen?

Simple difference between thinking you can do everything based on the numbers the computer spits out and knowing you can't - ask Dave Roberts and the Dodgers or anyone ever associated with the Rays how that works out. Of course, they're so busy polishing all their World Series trophies they may not have time to answer.
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Are y’all talking about trading allard and fried for The MadBum in SF that single handily pitched SF to WS title? Really??? Have you actually watched allard and fried pitch? Here’s a secret. Neither of those guys is that good and the reason they probably don’t have a future in Atlanta is that they kind of suck. Why would the Giants trade away one thier franchise faces for guys that suck?
 
JxnMissFan said:
Are y’all talking about trading allard and fried for The MadBum in SF that single handily pitched SF to WS title? Really??? Have you actually watched allard and fried pitch? Here’s a secret. Neither of those guys is that good and the reason they probably don’t have a future in Atlanta is that they kind of suck. Why would the Giants trade away one thier franchise faces for guys that suck?
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Allard does suck and is filled in any trade. Fried pitched really well as a starter this year and has good stuff

Also mad bum right now is not the same pitcher that he was when he won them that title. He also has 1 year left before FA. His price wont be that much.
 
I'm not high on Bumgarner these days. FIPs of 3.95 and 3.99 the last two years. Declining K rate, big jump in BB rate this year. Honestly, Anibal Sanchez was better than Bumgarner last season.

Bumgarner isn't an ace anymore. He's probably a little above average with a good risk of getting worse.
 
striker42 said:
I'm not high on Bumgarner these days. FIPs of 3.95 and 3.99 the last two years. Declining K rate, big jump in BB rate this year. Honestly, Anibal Sanchez was better than Bumgarner last season.

Bumgarner isn't an ace anymore. He's probably a little above average with a good risk of getting worse.
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Im not either, but for Fried/Allard if SFG would accept, and you get a QO with him at seasons end to offset losing them. Not to mention Allard/Fried dont really have a spot long-term with the Braves. Bumgarner might be declining but if you could get him for a package like that, it's worth considering.
 
Enscheff said:
Fried and Allard for Bumgarner...LOL

Before or after AA trades Albies for Dee Gordon?
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I'm still trying to figure out why we're trading valuable assets for an OFer with 7.5 career WAR in 4 seasons. I mean he's not terrible, but he isn't someone I'm sending anything resembling a top 10 prospect for. Much less Wilson and Muller.
 
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