2018 Offseason And Targets

Status
Not open for further replies.
striker42 said:
By that logic, why not expand the rosters by another dozen, have all 8 fielders be designated fielders, and have 9 designated hitters.

Personally, I don't like the DH because it elevates terribly flawed players to star status. If you can't field a lick, have a noodle arm, and run like a arthritic catcher, you can still be an MVP candidate if you can bat .300 and hit 40 HRs. I don't like that the DH can make 3 of the 5 tools irrelevant.
Click to expand...

* for one of nine positions.

Not having the DH makes all of the five tools irrelevant for one spot in the batting order 4-5 times per game.
 
striker42 said:
By that logic, why not expand the rosters by another dozen, have all 8 fielders be designated fielders, and have 9 designated hitters.

Personally, I don't like the DH because it elevates terribly flawed players to star status. If you can't field a lick, have a noodle arm, and run like a arthritic catcher, you can still be an MVP candidate if you can bat .300 and hit 40 HRs. I don't like that the DH can make 3 of the 5 tools irrelevant.
Click to expand...

Does it though? In a WAR based group-think those players get penalized heavily for being a DH. And if they played in the field their WAR numbers would still be suppressed for being horrible fielders.

Even without the DH you would see .300 and 40 HR hitters on teams. You would just have the displeasure of seeing them being butchers in the field if they truly are horrible on defense. But those guys player one way or another.
 
CrazyTrain said:
It's not a good idea because it removes a lot of the strategy that makes the NL so much more fun to watch.
Click to expand...

There isn't a lot of strategy to be honest. And it often means taking out pitchers who are doing well at a chance to get a run. That's not something I consider fun to watch.
 
thewupk said:
For you sure. The vast majority of people that watch baseball? Not likely. As more and more kids grow up playing the game with a DH and then become fans of MLB the DH will be the norm.
Click to expand...

Yes, casual fans who don't know anything about baseball love having another hitter to watch.

Intelligent fans don't want a DH because it dumbs down the game.

ESPN is going through the process of understanding what it's like to dumb things down... hence the birth of the Athletic.
 
thewupk said:
There isn't a lot of strategy to be honest. And it often means taking out pitchers who are doing well at a chance to get a run. That's not something I consider fun to watch.
Click to expand...

That's a very simpleton view IMO. I enjoy watching what managers will do in the late innings with these decisions to make. The NL is chess, the AL is checkers.
 
thewupk said:
Does it though? In a WAR based group-think those players get penalized heavily for being a DH. And if they played in the field their WAR numbers would still be suppressed for being horrible fielders.

Even without the DH you would see .300 and 40 HR hitters on teams. You would just have the displeasure of seeing them being butchers in the field if they truly are horrible on defense. But those guys player one way or another.
Click to expand...

I'm not sure the WAR penalization is actually equal to how horrible some of these guys would be in the field.

And I think if you're going to play baseball and all you can do is swing the bat, I think you should have to go out there and be a butcher in the field. I don't like hiding those guys' flaws by letting them just bat.
 
striker42 said:
I'm not sure the WAR penalization is actually equal to how horrible some of these guys would be in the field.

And I think if you're going to play baseball and all you can do is swing the bat, I think you should have to go out there and be a butcher in the field. I don't like hiding those guys' flaws by letting them just bat.
Click to expand...

This is exactly what Edgar Martinez was undeserving of the HOF. The DH is terrible.
 
CrazyTrain said:
Yes, casual fans who don't know anything about baseball love having another hitter to watch.

Intelligent fans don't want a DH because it dumbs down the game.

ESPN is going through the process of understanding what it's like to dumb things down... hence the birth of the Athletic.
Click to expand...

You consider yourself an intelligent fan but completely disregard how modern front offices evaluate trades. i.e surplus value

I consider myself an intelligent fan as well but I am all for the DH coming to the National League. Ideally, there wouldn't be a DH in either league. But, the DH isn't going away in the AL. And, it's baffling that two leagues play by different rules. Imagine extending Chipper's playing career. Freddie down the road. Retaining guys like Gattis (in a non-rebuilding year). I really hope it happens.
 
Last edited:
i don't particularly love that certain players can just walk up to the plate 4 times a game and that's it.
but i hate seeing pitchers try and bat, or being taken out of a game to try and scrape a run out, more.
 
striker42 said:
I'm not sure the WAR penalization is actually equal to how horrible some of these guys would be in the field.

And I think if you're going to play baseball and all you can do is swing the bat, I think you should have to go out there and be a butcher in the field. I don't like hiding those guys' flaws by letting them just bat.[/QUOTE]

I've always thought that if folks want more offense in the game, put those butchers in the field and watch medium flyouts turn into extra base hits. I'm only half-kidding.

Baseball is different than other sports in that teams have to make a lot of risk/reward decisions that teams in other sports don't have to make. I really don't want baseball turning into football where there is a specialist for every situation. Having to sacrifice defense for offense (and vice-versa) is part of the game. The beauty of baseball, at least to me, is that it mirrors real life more accurately than other sports. I don't want the game to lose that and that's not saying that the DH in the NL will do that.
Click to expand...
 
The DH has mostly evolved into a spot where AL teams rotate players through for rest instead of a standalone "position" occupied by one lumbering slugger. You have Nelson Cruz and Kendrys Morales who are (more or less) full-time designated hitters, but generally the DH in any given game is a normal player taking half a day off.

If the NL had the DH, the Braves would probably slot Camargo in there two or three times a week, then use the rest of the time to give breaks to Donaldson, Freeman and Markakis. A DH spot in the NL might induce some teams to keep weak glove/reasonable bat bench players, I suppose.
 
DontStopTheChop said:
You consider yourself an intelligent fan but completely disregard how modern front offices evaluate trades. i.e surplus value

I consider myself an intelligent fan as well but I am all for the DH coming to the National League. Ideally, there wouldn't be a DH in either league. But, the DH isn't going away in the AL. And, it's baffling that two leagues play by different rules. Imagine extending Chipper's playing career. Freddie down the road. Retaining guys like Gattis (in a non-rebuilding year). It would speed up the game. I really hope it happens.
Click to expand...

This is the reason (above all others) that the Braves should support it. IF they implement the rule in the NL, it now makes sense to pursue extensions for Freddie and even Donaldson through the period we control Albies and Acuna. It should make AA less willing to trade Riley as well. Given the success our scouts have had finding inexpensive international signings that turn into legitimate contributors (Albies, Acuna, Camargo, Pache, etc.), the ability to lock this core group together for the next 4-5 years ought to help lessen the damage caused by the international penalties that are on the way. With Riley, Pache, Waters, and Contreras getting relatively close and underrated guys like Jenista and C. J. Alexander beginning to move through the system, we shouldn't have to go outside the system and spend big on a free-agent bat for a while since you'd be able to keep Donaldson and Freeman healthier (in theory at least). Really dig for international position player signees that are 4-5 years away and if legitimate arms like Stinson and Ryne Nelson or Tyler Dyson are there when we pick in the 1st round in June, just keep stockpiling high-ceiling arms and figure out what to do with them as Gausman, Folty, etc. begin to get expensive.
 
CrazyTrain said:
Still better than watching some fat, unathletic asshole come up there to hack a few times a game and do literally nothing else of value. The DH is terrible.
Click to expand...

Someone clearly doesn't understand how the DH is used in the modern game.

Why am I not surprised?
 
striker42 said:
By that logic, why not expand the rosters by another dozen, have all 8 fielders be designated fielders, and have 9 designated hitters.

Personally, I don't like the DH because it elevates terribly flawed players to star status. If you can't field a lick, have a noodle arm, and run like a arthritic catcher, you can still be an MVP candidate if you can bat .300 and hit 40 HRs. I don't like that the DH can make 3 of the 5 tools irrelevant.
Click to expand...

Ahh, the good old slippery slope logical fallacy!

I was wondering when it would make an appearance haha.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top