sturg33
I
We are incredibly lucky Trump won and filled 3 seats
The Coronavirus, not the beer
- Thread starter Runnin
- Start date
We are incredibly lucky Trump won and filled 3 seats
nsacpi
Expects Yuge Games
I would say society has justification to intervene whenever a group is imposing substantial externalities. In this case there are three to consider:
1) spread of infections is greater among the unvaccinated...this affects everyone (the unvaccinated more so, but vaccinated are also put at risk via breakthrough cases)
2) people who get sick or become disabled pass on substantial costs to everyone else...we have a socialized system that covers medical care (via insurance) and disability...i don't see unvaccinated people agreeing to pay those bills out of pocket...if they did i would have a little more sympathy for their cries of tyranny...but they cry tyranny while passing on the bill to the rest of us...no thank you
3) more spread means more risk of variants that will defeat vaccines
other people should not have to bear the costs of this exercise of freedom...i'd be ok with the unvaccinated having their freedom if they signed a contract to pay out of pocket any medical care costs and disability costs that arise from their choice to be unvaccinated...of course it goes without saying they should compensate anyone they infect
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For starters you know (1) is false and if the at risk are protected by their vaccines than what does it matter? We have learned from Israel that spread is happening with vaccinated people so the mutations are there.
Then you also have established science that says the more that are vaccinated the more likely a variant becomes vaccine resistant. I know you hate that little factoid.
Then you also have established science that says the more that are vaccinated the more likely a variant becomes vaccine resistant. I know you hate that little factoid.
acesfull86
Well-known member
https://reason.com/2021/09/09/biden-rolls-out-industrial-policy-plan-to-overcome-government-created-covid-19-testing-shortages/
President Joe Biden announced his six-pronged COVID-19 Action Plan this evening. One prong of the plan aims to dramatically ramp up testing for the coronavirus throughout the country—something that should have been done a long time ago.
In that prong, Biden will invoke the Defense Production Act to spend nearly $2 billion on procuring 280 million rapid point-of-care and over-the-counter at-home COVID tests from multiple COVID-19 test manufacturers. That's just over $7 per test.
As I pointed out earlier today, the reason that Americans don't have access to cheap, fast COVID-19 self-tests right now is because the hypercautious regulators at the Food and Drug Administration (FDA) have been ridiculously slow to approve such tests. In fact, many of the self-tests widely and cheaply available now in Europe were developed here in the U.S. As the pandemic has worn on, FDA incompetence stymied the competitive processes that in private markets would have provided cheap, fast COVID-19 self-tests.
President Joe Biden announced his six-pronged COVID-19 Action Plan this evening. One prong of the plan aims to dramatically ramp up testing for the coronavirus throughout the country—something that should have been done a long time ago.
In that prong, Biden will invoke the Defense Production Act to spend nearly $2 billion on procuring 280 million rapid point-of-care and over-the-counter at-home COVID tests from multiple COVID-19 test manufacturers. That's just over $7 per test.
As I pointed out earlier today, the reason that Americans don't have access to cheap, fast COVID-19 self-tests right now is because the hypercautious regulators at the Food and Drug Administration (FDA) have been ridiculously slow to approve such tests. In fact, many of the self-tests widely and cheaply available now in Europe were developed here in the U.S. As the pandemic has worn on, FDA incompetence stymied the competitive processes that in private markets would have provided cheap, fast COVID-19 self-tests.
What is the point of mandating vaccines if they don't stop the spread? Pzier is down to like 39% effectiveness against the delta variant. 83% of Americans had antibodies through either the vaccine or being infected back in May. Surely we should have achieved herd immunity by now (experts said we needed between 70-90% to achieve this) if the vaccines really stopped you from getting it.
With that being said. I do believe the vaccine tremendously helps with people not getting really sick. So if you are fat or have any kind of comorbidity then it's a wise decision to get it. But by and large the vaccine isn't really doing **** to stop the spread right now.
With that being said. I do believe the vaccine tremendously helps with people not getting really sick. So if you are fat or have any kind of comorbidity then it's a wise decision to get it. But by and large the vaccine isn't really doing **** to stop the spread right now.
nsacpi
Expects Yuge Games
Percent of tests coming back positive in the most highly vaccinated states:
Vermont 4%
Connecticut 3%
Massachusetts 3%
Maine 6%
Rhode Island 2%
Percent of tests coming back positive in the most lightly vaccinated states:
Alabama 21%
Wyoming 11%
Idaho 20%
West Virginia 13%
Mississippi 19%
A pretty strong indication that vaccines are reducing spread as well as reducing hospitalizations and deaths.
It did this last summer as well. Those numbers may change this winter just like it did last year. Still, Pfizer is 39% effective against stopping infections from Delta. With as many people that have either gotten sick prior or had the vaccine we should have seen a tremendous slow down instead of it spiking like it is.
nsacpi
Expects Yuge Games
I'm a little confused. I thought home testing kits were available.
I found this article titled: How to shop for FDA-authorized home Covid test kits: A guide
https://www.nbcnews.com/shopping/wellness/best-home-covid-tests-n1275687
And another one titled: At-Home COVID-19 Antigen Tests: What You Should Know
https://www.nytimes.com/wirecutter/blog/at-home-covid-antigen-tests/
nsacpi
Expects Yuge Games
It will be interesting to see what happens as the weather gets colder. I will note that Idaho and Wyoming are at northern latitudes similar to the New England states.
acesfull86
Well-known member
I think the point is this could have and should have been done over a year ago. We wouldn’t need to enact the Defense Production Act in Sept 2021 because we wouldn’t be dealing with a (government caused) supply shortage.
FWIW, I followed the links in your NYT article and all of those tests they link are sold out. There are some in the NBC article are available, all for $100 and up.
Meanwhile, in Europe, you can find at home tests all over for $3-6 dollars, manufactured by US companies who can’t sell them here because they’re still not FDA approved.
At home testing is just another item on a long list of things our government has bungled during this crisis.
It will be interesting. But Pfizer is useless to 60% of the people that get it. So this mandate seems to be useless to stopping the spread of delta.
Idaho and Wyoming are the same latitude but they are different climates.
goldfly
<B>if my thought dreams could be seen</B>
So silly