2018 Offseason And Targets

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UNCBlue012 said:
Agreed, don't get me wrong. I was speaking in this regard. We absolutely have to nut-up and make a big-time trade for a guy like Kluber. For us to have a legit chance in the division, moves have to be made, and soon.
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Not necessarily, but I'd lean that way depending on how much money's actually available. Just for a second, let's assume MLBTR's projection of $135 million is right just for argument's sake - and that the owners get their way and the DH is implemented this year instead of next. A package for Kluber centered around Ender adds roughly $12 million, pushing payroll to around $125 million. Use as much of the other $10 million as needed to sign Marwin, leaving you Markakis, Marwin, Camargo, Duval, and at some point Riley to use on the corners and cycle through the DH slot when everyone else plays their regular positions.

That obviously wouldn't leave you with money for adds at the deadline, but if you've picked up Kluber and Gonzalez before you break camp, what other adds could you possibly be looking at in July??? Once next winter gets here, Acuna moves back to a corner and you pay Markakis' buyout and Pache takes over in CF (maybe even before then if you need his defense down the stretch).
 
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If I know one thing about baseball, it's that guys never get hurt, never under perform, and never need to be replaced at the deadline.

Therefore, it's probably best to blow the entire budget at the beginning and assume everyone will be fine.
 
striker42 said:
The Phillies are stupid if they trade a package like what's being rumored. Realmuto is good but how long will he be good? He'll be 28 by the start of the season. That's not young for a catcher. There's a good bet that he'll be in steep decline by the time he's a FA.

So while the Phils might have the money to re-sign him, it's still pretty much a rental. Realmuto in 2 years probably isn't the guy he was last year.
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The angle that makes a little sense is that they have compromised their long term ability to improve their team internally. It's a pretty weak angle, but it's accurate.

There is no rational reason to believe that Realmuto will be "in steep decline" in either of the next two seasons. Given he's going to be relatively cheap and on a non-guaranteed deal even if it he got Alzheimers over the All Star break there is no real risk.

The drawback to hoarding resources and mindfully trying to be a decent little playoff team for the longer period of time is that other clubs will always be going for it while you chug away and you are unlikely to ever find that you have the division to yourself, let alone the NL.

Which doesn't mean the Braves should have been doing stupid things this year, but there isn't likely to be a season where the Braves won't need to be stacked to give themselves the best chance of winning the East or the Pennant.
 
Enscheff said:
The Braves ended up with Mac at C and Markakis in RF, so I think it's safe to assume it prevented/influenced other deals. For example, JTR with Mac as the fallback option is why they didn't sign Grandal at a bargain rate. Knowing a JTR trade would require pitching likely meant they had to hold back cash to sign a SP, so they had to go cheap in RF.

It's looking more and more like AA jumped at JD, and then allowed the Marlins to hold the rest of his off season hostage.

Hopefully AA has something else on the trade front lined up that will pop off when the JTR saga finally ends. I just can't come up with any logical trade alternatives at this point in the off season.
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Grandal cost 19m+ after they'd signed Donaldson.

I don't think that is something they'd be interested in pursuing if you let them do it all over again.

I think it's pretty clear that they saw adding what they considered to be an MVP caliber player on a no risk deal was their first choice. I don't think they ever saw catcher as a priority. They were not in on Grandal or Ramos and they showed no urgency at all for Realmuto.

We will see what they finish with. I do not think it has been a bad offseason, but they haven't even done the small things that I expected yet. I should hope that is on the drawing board.
 
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Southcack77 said:
The angle that makes a little sense is that they have compromised their long term ability to improve their team internally. It's a pretty weak angle, but it's accurate.

There is no rational reason to believe that Realmuto will be "in steep decline" in either of the next two seasons. Given he's going to be relatively cheap and on a non-guaranteed deal even if it he got Alzheimers over the All Star break there is no real risk.

The drawback to hoarding resources and mindfully trying to be a decent little playoff team for the longer period of time is that other clubs will always be going for it while you chug away and you are unlikely to ever find that you have the division to yourself, let alone the NL.

Which doesn't mean the Braves should have been doing stupid things this year, but there isn't likely to be a season where the Braves won't need to be stacked to give themselves the best chance of winning the East or the Pennant.
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there is certainly real risk. their catcher was a 2.1 fWAR catcher last year, and an elite framer. they've moved to a guy who was a 4.5 WAR guy with average framing. improvement, definitely, but there's some risk that Alfaro isn't that far off JTR the next couple season, PLUS you've traded by far your best prospect.

keeping a strong farm system isn't as important for the phillies as it is for atlanta..but it's pretty damn important for every team. i'm not of the opinion that the braves are simply "hoarding resources." there has to be a price that's too high, and if guys aren't being valued as the GM feels they should, those players shouldn't be dealt. trading them guarantees the braves nothing, either. nothing is every guaranteed. so overpaying just because other teams are "going for it" seems dumb. i'd rather they give themselves a shot at the playoffs every year the next 10 than "go for it" for 2.
 
Southcack77 said:
Grandal cost 19m+ after they'd signed Donaldson.

I don't think that is something they'd be interested in pursuing if you let them do it all over again.

I think it's pretty clear that they saw adding what they considered to be an MVP caliber player on a no risk deal was their first choice. I don't think they ever saw catcher as a priority. They were not in on Grandal or Ramos and they showed no urgency at all for Realmuto.

We will see what they finish with. I do not think it has been a bad offseason, but they haven't even done the small things that I expected yet. I should hope that is on the drawing board.
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JD and Mac were signed almost simultaneously. That means the 3B and C plans were intertwined at that point. If those plans included a potential JTR acquisition (they almost certainly did), then the Braves had already ruled out Grandal (another near certainty).

The Braves chose JD plus Mac or JTR, and removed any chance of getting a bargain on Grandal the moment they made that decision because of that plan. They had already committed the bulk of their cash to JD because they were happy with having Mac and MAYBE having JTR. AA's boner for JD and allowing himself to be held hostage by the Marlins is why the off season unfolded as it did.

It doesn't take the superhuman brain of a sales engineer to understand how this was all related. We plebs with mortal brains can understand it just fine.
 
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AA keeps talking about not doing anything unless it’s for a great value....

Translation = we are committed to mediocrity and will only add pieces no one wants...unless I have a man crush like JD...we may make the playoffs then be 4th in the division next year, so buy season tickets because you never know what you will get
 
#Phillies #Marlins deal agreed upon. 4 players going to #Marlins including Sanchez and Alfaro in return for Realmuto.
 
Passan: Philadelphia and Miami are in agreement on a trade that would send All-Star catcher J.T. Realmuto to the Phillies for catcher Jorge Alfaro, pitching prospects Sixto Sanchez and Will Stewart, and an international bonus slot, league sources familiar with the deal tell ESPN.
 
UNCBlue012 said:
Passan: Philadelphia and Miami are in agreement on a trade that would send All-Star catcher J.T. Realmuto to the Phillies for catcher Jorge Alfaro, pitching prospects Sixto Sanchez and Will Stewart, and an international bonus slot, league sources familiar with the deal tell ESPN.
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That's 5 years of a low end regular catcher, a FV 55/60 P (depending on how you ding him for injury concerns), and FV 40 P, and bonus slot money.

Seems like a fair-ish return for JTR. A bit of an overpay if you think Sixto is a legit 60.

I wouldn't have been too upset to see AA beat that package, though Sixto is likely more valuable than anything the Braves could have offered.
 
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Don't understand why we wouldn't top that package. We have multiple comparable arms to Sixto. Alfaro hasn't even remotely lived up to expectations. And the Phillies kept all of the other rumored top prospects. Phillies did well here. Gave up one legit but risky prospect for the best C in the game. If they get Harper, the Phillies lock up the east.
 
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