Brandon Taubman
- Thread starter nsacpi
- Start date
nsacpi
Expects Yuge Games
all I wanted to see was for Taubman to be a mensch and own up to what he did...still waiting btw
not owning up to your **** behavior is a trend these days.
This is a pretty cut and dried issue. Taubman is a moron who couldn't shut his mouth for one night and felt like he just had to rub it into these female journalists' faces. I think anyone can understand his temptation to do that; I'm sure he knew they were opening themselves up to some backlash when they signed Osuna, he hated that the domestic violence was brought up over and over by the same people, and so he vented in a really dumb and hurtful way in what he felt was a moment of some sort of vindication.
He should have owned up to it and apologized, and the Astros should have acknowledged it from the beginning. I definitely don't see it as a mistake clearly worthy of being fired, but that is the Astros' call to make, and they made it. I don't think anyone should have demanded he be fired, and I don't think anyone should be upset that he ultimately was.
He should have owned up to it and apologized, and the Astros should have acknowledged it from the beginning. I definitely don't see it as a mistake clearly worthy of being fired, but that is the Astros' call to make, and they made it. I don't think anyone should have demanded he be fired, and I don't think anyone should be upset that he ultimately was.
BeanieAntics
Arbitration Eligible
I don't agree with Coredor in the sense that this was a bad incident and one that he probably needed to be fired for. Obviously encouraging respect and politeness in the workplace is a good thing. But I do think that Coredor has a point in the sense that the public shaming machine is a pretty terrible thing and can have long lasting impacts on a person's psyche.
If you make a mistake like this, you should face consequences that are suitable for whatever mistake you made. Having literally millions of people on social media berate you, drag your name through the mud, and, in some ways, bully you is not proportional to this particular mistake. Not only does it severely harm future job prospects and your social life, but it can have serious psychology ramifications that can take years to heal.
What he did was worse than what Justine Sacco did for sure, but the response to both of them was way out of proportion and its not hard to sympathize with them in that regard, while also maybe condemning what they have done (and I'm not condemning Justine for what she did. It wasn't that bad).
BeanieAntics
Arbitration Eligible
If that were the actual outcome of situations like this then I'd be 100% with your sarcasm here. The fact is that this isn't the world we are creating. We are creating a world where forgiveness is an antiquated concept. Where people can't make mistakes without having their whole world come crumbling down around them. Where apologies only make things worse. Where the apology itself is heavily scrutinized.
BeanieAntics
Arbitration Eligible
I mean, he did apologize. It may have been perceived as a weak apology, and maybe it was. But I'm not sure it would help if he came out and unequivocally apologized for the entire incident, accepting total responsibility. It may satisfy you personally, but my experience with the social media mob is that apologies aren't accepted and often just make things worse. Morally it might be the right thing to do. But strategically, the best option is often to double down on whatever you did. That's not right, but that is the world we are creating.
BeanieAntics
Arbitration Eligible
See my post above for the reasons why this is. If owning up worked and it was possible to be forgiven, I promise you that more people would do it.
nsacpi
Expects Yuge Games
what social media seems to do is compress the time available for reflection and atonement...in the pre-social media world Taubman would have had more time to own up to his actions and to make amends before facing the risk of losing his job
BeanieAntics
Arbitration Eligible
Yeah this is pretty much my thought as well. I'm not bummed out that he was fired. He needed some sort of repercussions and this was probably suitable. But that should be it, it should be over and he should be allowed to move on with his life peacefully. If he chooses to continue being an asshole, I'm sure that there is someone out there who'll expose it so we can do this all over again. If he chooses to be better, then people should get off his back.
Sometimes it honestly looks like twitter or reddit are advocating capital punishment for things like this. Some of the things said about this guy on there are beyond disgusting. In many ways, they are almost worse than what this guy did in the first place.
nsacpi
Expects Yuge Games
I don't think I would call that an apology. It was more an evasion. But I have a jaundiced view of apologies in general. More often than not they serve as a means for perpetuating the behavior for which the apology is offered. In my book it is always better to engage in sincere reflection than to offer an apology. Of course if you can do both you should (keeping in mind that apologies mainly work to the benefit of the people offering them). In Taubman's situation though there was the practical reality that his job was at stake. So he needed to own up to his actions in a better way. Maybe he didn't realize that. Maybe he is incapable in his current state of doing it.
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BeanieAntics
Arbitration Eligible
I agree, but it does a lot more than that. Like I said, it can be absolutely BRUTAL for the person on the receiving end of it. I've been on the receiving end of a relatively mild example twice.
I'm an MLB The Show streamer/Youtuber and I've had people come after me for a thing I did and a thing I didn't do, but was accused of. A few years ago there was a mass perma-ban on MLB The Show because the developers thought that people were using a complicated exploit to give themselves an advantage. I was caught in the crossfire along with a couple other well known people in the community. I spent a day or two getting absolutely trashed by viewers and other community members for "cheating" the game, all the while trying to get unbanned because I didn't do anything at all. It was pretty scary, because I make a solid amount of side money off this that really helps out. Turns out, SDS had a malfunction in some of their software or something and that NOBODY had done anything wrong at all. I got one apology from the dozens of KYS-like messages that I received.
The other time was a lot less severe and it stemmed from me letting the N-Word slip while jokingly singing Khia's "My Neck, My Back"... Most people thought it was funny, but I still felt the need to apologize. I didn't get any hate messages or anything like that until after I apologized. It wasn't anything crazy, but it was still really interesting to me that nobody said anything at all until they smelled blood in the water from my apology. I learned something from that and I rarely apologize for anything nowadays.
These are two extremely mild cases relative to what goes on, mostly because my audience and social footprint is pretty small. But for more well known people or people that get thrust into the spotlight, its pretty crazy.
BeanieAntics
Arbitration Eligible
I think almost everyone has a jaundiced view of apologies. And you're right that in many ways it wasn't a great apology. My point is that, hypothetically, if he had issued an incredibly sincere and heartfelt apology, it wouldn't have helped. He likely still would have been fired and the backlash wouldn't have subsided at all. See: Justine Sacco. The only thing that can really help someone like Taubman at this point is time. After some time has passed, people will move on to someone else and he'll be (mostly) out of the woods. But I doubt he'll ever be able to work in the public eye again.
BeanieAntics
Arbitration Eligible
I've completely acknowledged that Taubman was wrong for what he did and deserved to be fired. But the social media mob is a serious issue that is really relevant to this story. Other than his firing, I'm not sure what people like you want from the man other than that? Does his firing not absolve the debt?
Maybe we need to get your avatar and get him to imprison folks like this in La Cabana so he can issue summary judgements that lead to their eventual execution?
goldfly
<B>if my thought dreams could be seen</B>
Freshmaker
Arbitration Eligible
Also don't forget that Osuna blew the save against the Yankees that game. If he'd come into the game in the 8th and put out a fire, then maybe some sort of logical argument for the comments can be made. But in came on in the 9th and gave up 2 runs to blow it. Then Taubman goes on his I'm glad we have him idiocy