Fredi fired

The defense of Fredi by DOB and Schultz is ridiculous, too, and missing the greater point. Everybody is so damn concerned about Fredi being "a nice guy." It was the same crap with Mark Richt. Atlanta/Georgia sports media is a joke.

It's getting uncomfortable with those two. DOB seems legitimately hurt that Fredi is gone after his tweet today saying people will just find another person to blame things on. Schultz called the firing "disgusting." Pretty embarrassing day for the AJC that their emotions get involved as much as they have.

Hopefully the next manager will ride motorcycles and eat BBQ with DOB so that he'll chill out.
 
What I can't understand is this thought that Fredi manages from a spreadsheet. He may be the least information-driven manager I've ever seen.

Cox was more information-driven than many think and I believe the same would be true of Fredi. Again, it's the image thing.

Bobby Cox was a great manager and he won with a lot of different types of teams on offense. The staple for Bobby outside of a few instances was his teams had stellar starting pitching. That can make anyone look a lot smarter than they are.
 
It's getting uncomfortable with those two. DOB seems legitimately hurt that Fredi is gone after his tweet today saying people will just find another person to blame things on. Schultz called the firing "disgusting." Pretty embarrassing day for the AJC that their emotions get involved as much as they have.

Hopefully the next manager will ride motorcycles and eat BBQ with DOB so that he'll chill out.

Have to remember those two have been around the team for as long as anyone on the 25 man roster.

They've developed personal relationships with players and coaches.

They probably know how much of a nice guy Fredi is more than w r do.
 
But again, I guess the problem is the timing of this decision invites people like them to think that. I know why his ass needed to be fired, but I'm not convinced this front office knew.
 
Cox was more information-driven than many think and I believe the same would be true of Fredi. Again, it's the image thing.

Bobby Cox was a great manager and he won with a lot of different types of teams on offense. The staple for Bobby outside of a few instances was his teams had stellar starting pitching. That can make anyone look a lot smarter than they are.

He also seemed to get the best out of players. Something that can't be said for Fredi.
 
FWIW - EVERY SINGLE host and analyst on XM today has called the move an utter joke. The funny thing about this is that they're right to a point. Really can't disagree with them when they say that this sure does smell like the brass is trying to deflect the attention that they put such a *hitty team together this season that NO ONE could've won more than a couple more games with this group - AND that they misled fans by creating unreachable expectations.

Again, this appears not to have anything to do with Fredi's Xs and Os - apparently. I understand (and even agree at times) when some people who are watching every inning of every game criticize some of his moves. It's understandable when people complain about Mallex not playing or leading off as well IMO. Even his questionable handling of the pen at times. The thing is, Hart didn't mention any of these as being concerns. He says "we need a new voice". I'm sorry, but a new voice isn't going to help this team win more games - this is a BAD team, and the only thing that's going to help it win more games is better players. Hart's just playing politics and speaking GM-Speak because admitting that would 1.) mean he's admitting they did a bad job cobbling the team together last winter and 2.) mean that they were outright lying when they tried to sell the idea that the team would be better than last season.

I think many of us understood that that's what they were doing all along, and that we were prepared to be really bad. The difference is that most people here aren't your typical "fans" - folks here pay much closer attention than your "average" or "typical" fan. However these "experts" who have a podium to shout from don't see the mistakes (in our opinions) that he often makes because they're not watching nearly as closely. Those guys somehow believe that Fredi's being "blamed" or made to be a "scapegoat" unfairly. From afar, that's kinda understandable - the brass didn't come out and list any reasons other than wanting a new voice in the clubhouse.

But it's not always about just winning or losing; it's about how you are winning or losing. The team has been sleepwalking and there's just no excuse for that. For all we know, Hart and Coppolella asked Markakis and some of the other vets about the temperature of the team and it was decided that Fredi had to go.
 
He also seemed to get the best out of players. Something that can't be said for Fredi.

Some guys yes and some guys no. I'm not about to blame Fredi because Melvin Upton, Jr., forgot what that wooden stick he walked to the plate with was for. And I'm not a Fredi defender or a Cox derider. Fredi's biggest problem was his bullpen usage patterns.
 
Some guys yes and some guys no. I'm not about to blame Fredi because Melvin Upton, Jr., forgot what that wooden stick he walked to the plate with was for. And I'm not a Fredi defender or a Cox derider. Fredi's biggest problem was his bullpen usage patterns.

Yep. Along with a ridiculous devotion to righty-lefty, lefty-righty in every aspect, regardless of relevant statistics to a given situation.
 
Some guys yes and some guys no. I'm not about to blame Fredi because Melvin Upton, Jr., forgot what that wooden stick he walked to the plate with was for. And I'm not a Fredi defender or a Cox derider. Fredi's biggest problem was his bullpen usage patterns.

Without question. The biggest sigh of relief today came from the elbows of every reliever in our bullpen.
 
Some guys yes and some guys no. I'm not about to blame Fredi because Melvin Upton, Jr., forgot what that wooden stick he walked to the plate with was for. And I'm not a Fredi defender or a Cox derider. Fredi's biggest problem was his bullpen usage patterns.

Agree as far as his actual in game management went. I do think a bigger problem existed in the fact that he never seemed to support his players. Instead, he makes comments like Alex Wood needs to control himself in that situation....etc.
 
Agree as far as his actual in game management went. I do think a bigger problem existed in the fact that he never seemed to support his players. Instead, he makes comments like Alex Wood needs to control himself in that situation....etc.

I agree that Fredi didn't jump in for his guys like Bobby did and as much as I laughed whenever Bobby would defend a guy for doing something incredibly stupid, I imagine that does create problems in the clubhouse.
 
I agree that Fredi didn't jump in for his guys like Bobby did and as much as I laughed whenever Bobby would defend a guy for doing something incredibly stupid, I imagine that does create problems in the clubhouse.

It would for me. Bobby was always great at keeping things "in house". It was very rare that he made an example publicly like he did with Andruw Jones that time.
 
But it's not always about just winning or losing; it's about how you are winning or losing. The team has been sleepwalking and there's just no excuse for that. For all we know, Hart and Coppolella asked Markakis and some of the other vets about the temperature of the team and it was decided that Fredi had to go.

No question. Again, I'm not the one saying that - I've been watching every inning like everyone here has.

The point was that if you haven't been, it's easy to say that none of that's relevant since the brass WON'T say that. The guys on XM have been saying for weeks that it's beyond ridiculous to try to hang any of this on Fredi, and they are right insofar as even the great Joe Maddon likely couldn't have squeezed more than a handful more wins out of this collection of players. Bench Aybar when you're BEST option behind him is Castro? Hit WHO behind Freeman? Play WHO at 3B? That's all outsiders can see, and the answers thus far have been Francoeur, KJ, A. J., Flowers, and Beckham. Many of them have said (correctly IMO) that Fredi's hands were completely tied if you're not willing to call guys like Swanson and Albies up. IF the brass has been telling the truth that they'll be called up when they're ready (or the best available options) and money and service-time AREN'T the overriding concerns, Fredi should've been able to pencil them into the lineup if winning games was important in any form. They (the talk show guys) understand the reasons you're trying to game everyone's clocks from an organizational standpoint, but they think it's "unfair" to hang anything on Fredi when you've given him no better options - and are playing keep-away with a couple as well. That's the point I find hard to argue with.
 
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