GDT 4/16; On the Menu: CAJUN FRIED SNAKEMEAT.

Per the bullpen, it was shaky last season, but things fell into place. I just think Anthopoulos and the rest of the brass went forward on some iffy propositions that some of the marginal guys would either maintain or perhaps even improve. That hasn't happened to this point, but maybe it will.
 
We can’t make whole sale changes to this pen and bringing in CK won’t address BIddles, Sobo and Minters issues. Just need to keep working these guys and showing them that it is ok to go after someone with 2 strikes. Guys are going to suck sometimes. I just don’t understand how a whole pen can suck on one night.

Biddle seems to never do well with guys already on. I need to look at splits to see if my eyes are lying. When he starts an inning it usually goes better. At least I think that is what I remember. Sobo seemed to figure somethings out his last few outings and yesterday just couldn’t control anything. Jackson continues to be snake bit. Minter continues to make bad pitches at least once every outing. Just one of those nights.

I think for now you stay the course but let these guys know while they are running today that another bed ****ter and they are ridding a bus for a few weeks and another guy is taking their place in the roster.
 
the pen is OK but i think it clearly needs work. sure, it had been good since the opening series. but just looking at the guys in it, i'm not sure that should've been expected to continue. sobotka being the first guy out in a close game isn't great. minter has been far too shaky for me, even last year when he was pretty good, to trust fully. he's your only good option currently vs. lefties, and isn't great vs. righties.

you really may need to move touki there for this season and see how it goes. he instantly has the best stuff in the pen. newcomb could be helpful vs. lefties, and that's desperately needed right now.

even kimbrel doesn't help instantly.
 
once (if) the rotation is healthy and set, wilson could also maybe help in the pen. may have to choose one of he or touki to work out of there.
 
Super said:
once (if) the rotation is healthy and set, wilson could also maybe help in the pen. may have to choose one of he or touki to work out of there.
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If we have to move starting prospects to fix the pen, I think Wilson is the best fit.

I remember Kiley talking in the past about how he could be an elite multi-inning reliever that went through the lineup one time. Obviously Snit isn't smart enough to manage something like that, but Wilson really would thrive in that role.
 
Snitker came into a bad situation where we was assumed to be temporary and performed well. He manages a team that vastly exceeded expectations last year to make the playoffs. Every indication is that his players love him.

Yet I read daily on here how awful he is.
 
I'm trying so hard to not be frustrated, but last night was just bad. We're beginning what looks to be a long window of contention and we may lose a year because of our bullpen. The rotation and lineup look to be fine, but the BP is going to cost us many, many games. AA has to suck it up and go make moves, whether it means signing Kimbrel or finding someone else. CK may not fix the 'pen, but he'd make it a whole hell of a lot better.
 
CJ9 said:
If we have to move starting prospects to fix the pen, I think Wilson is the best fit.

I remember Kiley talking in the past about how he could be an elite multi-inning reliever that went through the lineup one time. Obviously Snit isn't smart enough to manage something like that, but Wilson really would thrive in that role.
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I remember reading the early scouting reports on Wilson and a lot of them contended that he could be a dominant bullpen guy, but were a bit skeptical about this ability to develop into a front-line starter. Of course, the scouts were looking at a high school pitcher with a plus fastball with downward movement and a lot of them may have just stopped there. I seem to recall that he was viewed as a two-pitch guy in desperate need to develop a workable third pitch.
 
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jsebe10 said:
If we are basing it on the kids’ extensions and his ability to bargain shop with position players this past offseason then yes...

If it’s in terms of bullpen arms then NO. It’s been a complete failure. A bullpen with an ERA of 4.15 and near the tops in the league in walks last season requires fixing. They did NOTHING.

Look man I don’t know what else you all need to see to comprehend that he screwed the pooch on the bullpen this season. How is tonight not an obvious indicator?
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Because its happening all over baseball? Because bullpen meltdowns will happen?

Sobotka was a flat out stud last year. This year, he's got no feel for where its going. Stuff like that happens.
 
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Im finding it hard to blame AA. Sobo looked awesome last year. Biddle is atill really good. Minter should be good.

Winkler is back. Carle should be fine.

Hard to predict what happens with pen arms.
 
Hudson2 said:
No thanks on moving our best starting pitching prospects to the bullpen to fix a problem that should of been addressed in the offseason.
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It should have. But if Touki, wilson, and/or Wright are throwing important innings in the majors out of the pen shouldn’t stunt or impact their growth as a starter. Learning to get MLB guys out in pressure situations might be more valuable than anything in AAA.

if Newk goes it needs to be forever
 
thethe said:
Im finding it hard to blame AA. Sobo looked awesome last year. Biddle is atill really good. Minter should be good.

Winkler is back. Carle should be fine.

Hard to predict what happens with pen arms.
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The Braves biggest issue last year was pitching - bullpen AND starters. AA quite obviously leaned on our young arms to further developt. If you have young starters that you know are growing, you absolutely owe it to them to put a good bullpen behind them for support. AA didn't and it could be a legit issue this year. One game doesn't seem like a big deal now, but when we're expecting to be in a two-to-three game dog fight for the division titile with several games, it's huge. This is fully on AA for not making moves when he had the resources.
 
Hudson2 said:
No thanks on moving our best starting pitching prospects to the bullpen to fix a problem that should of been addressed in the offseason.
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How many of them does a team need - honestly?

Sure, moving some of them to the pen may hurt their trade values, but apparently AA isn't going to trade any of them anyway.

This would all be (and was) different if you weren't in your contention window. When you aren't expecting to compete, of course you keep them all and let things fall where they will. The Braves are past that position. They've made two win-now signings (Donaldson and Mac), they've locked the core up (does anybody NOT think extensions for Freeman and Dansby are coming if they're reasonable?), and they simply don't have room for ALL the MLB-ready SPs.

This team is built to win now AND for several years to come, and you don't get rings for having the best AAA and AA pitching staffs on the planet. If a couple of these guys can become legitimate weapons out of the pen for a team that has as *hitty a pen as we do and AA doesn't at least try to use them if he's not adding from outside, he's not doing his job.

There's a fine line between panic and action sometimes - while he doesn't need to go groveling to Kimbrel and give away a draft pick, he has to do something to at least let the guys in the clubhouse know he's trying to help before it's too late to do anything.
 
thethe said:
Im finding it hard to blame AA. Sobo looked awesome last year. Biddle is atill really good. Minter should be good.

Winkler is back. Carle should be fine.

Hard to predict what happens with pen arms.
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It’s hard NOT to blame AA. Bullpen arms weren’t that expensive this past offseason and we didn’t acquire a single one. Viz and O’Day had injury questions and they was bound to be regression to some of the those guys. He should gotten at least 2 good arms to help the team out.
 
bravesfanMatt said:
It should have. But if Touki, wilson, and/or Wright are throwing important innings in the majors out of the pen shouldn’t stunt or impact their growth as a starter. Learning to get MLB guys out in pressure situations might be more valuable than anything in AAA.

if Newk goes it needs to be forever
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Newk has been given enough rope at this point where he may need to be transitioned to the bullpen and maybe Wilson also bc he’s the weakest of the big prospects. But with the health so far of Gausman, Folty, and Soroka I’d hold off on moving Touki or Wright out there.
 
should also be noted that a lot of bullpens are struggling to start the year. bullpens have been really bad.
 
Hudson2 said:
Newk has been given enough rope at this point where he may need to be transitioned to the bullpen and maybe Wilson also bc he’s the weakest of the big prospects. But with the health so far of Gausman, Folty, and Soroka I’d hold off on moving Touki or Wright out there.
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I don't think they gave him much rope at all. If you don't trust him to control whether he throws strikes, not sure how the bullpen is a better option. Seems like you should just see what the Rays will give you and prepare for his eventual transformation.
 
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