nsacpi
Expects Yuge Games
kinda shocking
GDT--Sat, 6/30 vs Cards
- Thread starter salmagundy
- Start date
kinda shocking
msstate7
Well-known member
We have 2 LH relievers, and snit used one of them up huge. Snit is a dummy. Throw Luke Jackson again or moylan... not freeman though. Such a stupid move
The stupid is due to nobody claiming Markakis hasn’t been worth his contract...
You are a complete buffoon that is so dumb you can’t even understand that you’re dumb.
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Exactly. He is trying to make fun of someone for something nobody ever claimed.
Derptard gonna derp.
Braves1976
It's OVER 5,000!
Freeman will continue blowing big games with such an insane usage, he is only human not a robot
zbhargrove
Well-known member
I as well cannot exactly figure out any sort of point you're trying to make...
jpx7
Very Flirtatious, but Doubts What Love Is.
Because I’m a masochist, I went back to check the thread, and I was right: by and large, the concerns were Markakis’ defense, the final two years of the deal (which were looking pretty bad after 2017, but which 2018 has obviously really buoyed), and why Hart thought it was a good use of a rebuilding team’s resources. There were also a lot of photos of James Franco c/o [MENTION=18]Dalyn[/MENTION].
This seems a representative post, inasmuch as that’s possible for a 60+ page thread:
Southcack77
Well-known member
The rationale was also that the last season would be the worst season and that he’d be almost unplayable.
jpx7
Very Flirtatious, but Doubts What Love Is.
Indeed—and the fact that the fourth year decidedly hasn’t been his worst season (much less unplayably bad) has been wildly awesome.
It’s also salvaging the deal for the Braves, since Markakis mildly underperformed his salary in 2015 and vastly underperformed it in 2017. All-in-all, it’s working out to market-value in a circuitous fashion that’s timed just right for the Braves (like so many things heretofore in 2018).
Southcack77
Well-known member
If you use bWar and $8m he gave surplus value in 1 and 2.
I think for the most part the deal was a whatever.
I’m happy he’s had a great first half when the Braves needed it. I thought he’d probably be about like last year or worse.
The only problem with this statement is that you guys run away from those "absolutes" when they don't fit your narratives...
"No I'm saying even at 25M year for 8 years, that would have been a better course than acquiring Markakis, Miller, Jenkins plus an extra $5M/year of financial flexibility." (nsacpi on 12/4/14)
"Imagine this:
It's Opening Day, and Nick Markakis steps to home plate for the first time as an Atlanta Brave. The stadium is filled to 50% capacity, but the crowd manages a semi-rousing 'welcome to Atlanta' ovation. Markakis tips his helmet, digs in, breathes, but suddenly flips his hand back to the umpire indicating his desire for a time-out. It's granted. He steps back and suddenly inexplicably starts clawing his face, tearing skin and hair off -- the sight is gruesome, Fredi Gonzalez weeps ... but suddenly, from under the bits of superficial flesh emerges JASON HEYWARD!
"I knew this was the only way my agent, who was trying to negotiate a $250MM deal apparently completely behind my back, would ever allow me to sign with Atlanta. So I killed Nick Markakis and slipped into his exoderm for a few months. NOW WHAT KIND OF BARGAIN AM I?"
And the Braves lived happily ever after, for four years.
The end." (Hawk - 12/5/2014)
"Finally, Markakis on a 4-year deal is questionable in a vaccuum, and even more questionable given our focus on 2016 - 2018." (dak - 1/5/15)
"This is the kind fo trade a rebuilding team would make. the problem is we did the dumb Markakis signing." (zito on 1/1/2015)
"Nothing wrong with it at like 2/25, it's the 4/44 that I have a problem with. We're paying a lot of money for an old guy who will probably suck when we hope to be competitive." (zito on 1/1/2015)
"Markakis to Terdo is 10-20 win difference?" (Russ2dollas on 1/1/2015)
"Last 3 years Markakis has a 104 wRC+, Rasmus 102, Markakis had a 4 fWAR and Rasmus a 6.4.
Last 2 years Markakis has a 97 wRC+, Rasmus 117, Markakis had a 2.4 WAR and Rasmus a 5.4
If Rasmus is awful, what does that make Markakis?" (zito again on 1/1/2015)
"However, I will say this. The Markakis signing is the most overblown bad move (I don't like it) I have ever seen." (chop2chip on 1/1/2015)
"(You're aware that Heyward slugged .384 while Markakis slugged .386 last season, right???) I'm going to save this here on a platter for somebody else to respond to." (Hawk on 12/2/2014)
"I think Markakis is a decent player, but if we sign him to a 3- or 4-year deal, we're crazy. MFII is right. The last two years of the contract may be Melvinesque." (50 on 12/3/2014)
"4/45 for a 31 year old Markakis is an absolute joke. He was horrific in 2013 and in 2014 he lived off his great 1st and in the 2nd half he was a 250 hitter with a 700 OPS with horrible D." (BRule on 12/3/2014)
"Now I'm curious as to just what exactly Hart was sniffing before he was sniffing around Markakis." (Forever Fredi on 12/3/2014)
"Our front office has gone full retard." (Cy Young 31 on 12/3/2014)
"Heyward's at .335, .351, and .349 the last 3 years for OBP.
HUGE DIFFERENCE
MARKAKIS SUCKS HEYWARD IS THE BEST PLAYER IN BASEBALL" (Heyward on 12/3/2014)
"I think this is a bad deal that's likely to look really ugly within a year or two. We might get a normal Nick Markakis season out of him in 2015, but that's nothing terribly impressive, and I suspect that by mid-2016 we'll be looking at another Uggla situation, if not quite as awful."
and
"For the record, potential better options: Colby Rasmus on a one or two-year make-good contract, Michael Saunders from the M's, especially since the Jays just got him for Generic Soft-Tossing Lefty 7A." (MadduxFan II on 12/3/2014)
"Markakis is a 10 war player. Whitneess Above Replacement." (cajunrevenge on 12/3/2014)
"Markakis isn't worth the money he'll get but a guy like Heyward making 25 mill a year is well worth it and more. Until they can fully grasp this concept the Atlanta Braves are not going to amount to much." (BemenFan88 on 12/3/2014)
"It will be nice to have Pedroia v2.0 on the roster." (The Blackjack Dealer discussing Jace Peterson on 1/7/15 - just had to toss that one in. How'd those numbers work out?)
jpx7
Very Flirtatious, but Doubts What Love Is.
It’s pretty classically baseball that the most contentious aspect—the fourth year of the contract—is actually turning into a magical, probable-All Star season that redeems (and then some) the whole enterprise.
jpx7
Very Flirtatious, but Doubts What Love Is.
I always eschew absolutes because I don’t believe in any.
msstate7
Well-known member
Markakis certainly wasn't anything to write home about years 1-3. If we make the playoffs this year on the back of his putting up a huge season, gotta admit the signing at least paid off when it counted.
rico43
<B>Director of Minor League Reports</B>
The Markakis bashing seems almost Trump-like in its consistency. The points I'll concede is that the deal was a big gamble in that he was coming off neck surgery, but it's that same reason I felt like his first year would be the biggest aberration from his career levels.
Without putting the analytical microscope to his numbers -- I believe anyone can find an analytic to back up their argument about any player -- I felt his signing was exactly what it has become: a guy you can write down every day on the lineup card and who will give you his best every day without drama, excess noise (i.e., media) and who will produce within predictable parameters.
His 162-game career average (and he has always been able in at least 155 games every year but one since 2007) are .289-15-79 with 189 hits, 39 doubles. His average after 3 1/2 seasons with Atlanta is .287. His home run total dropped and his strikeout totals soared the last two years, but everything else remained consistent about his career. I am on the fence on whether or not to re-sign him, when compared to other free agent signings the last decade or so, he's turned out pretty darn well.
It also notable that his four-year deal was for $11 million per year. His final two years with the Orioles, he was paid $15 million per year.
Without putting the analytical microscope to his numbers -- I believe anyone can find an analytic to back up their argument about any player -- I felt his signing was exactly what it has become: a guy you can write down every day on the lineup card and who will give you his best every day without drama, excess noise (i.e., media) and who will produce within predictable parameters.
His 162-game career average (and he has always been able in at least 155 games every year but one since 2007) are .289-15-79 with 189 hits, 39 doubles. His average after 3 1/2 seasons with Atlanta is .287. His home run total dropped and his strikeout totals soared the last two years, but everything else remained consistent about his career. I am on the fence on whether or not to re-sign him, when compared to other free agent signings the last decade or so, he's turned out pretty darn well.
It also notable that his four-year deal was for $11 million per year. His final two years with the Orioles, he was paid $15 million per year.
Russ2dollas
10 yr, $185 million Extension
I stand by what I said. In no way did I see neck doing this this year and neither did anyone else.
Add to that if you told me neck would have a 900 ops any year of the deal I would not have thought we were winning enough to matter
I still would not sign that deal. If you are tanking you tank it. Let terdo suck for a couple years.
No neck and we have a spot for a marlins of.
Add to that if you told me neck would have a 900 ops any year of the deal I would not have thought we were winning enough to matter
I still would not sign that deal. If you are tanking you tank it. Let terdo suck for a couple years.
No neck and we have a spot for a marlins of.
jpx7
Very Flirtatious, but Doubts What Love Is.
Where’s the bashing?
Again, the crux was whether it made sense for the Braves to allot resources, during a deep teardown/rebuild, to a guy they could “write down every day on the lineup card and who [would] give you his best every day without drama, excess noise (i.e., media) and who [would] produce within predictable parameters.” The “yes” arguments tended towards leadership and mentorship, and the “no” towards leveraging every available dollar and roster-spot in service of longer-term payouts.
Markakis proved us all wrong by eclipsing his predicable parameters and going All Star in a season where the Braves started contending a year early. That’s legitimately awesome, but doesn’t change the calculus on Hart’s decision, whether you supported or maligned it originally.
Again, the crux was whether it made sense for the Braves to allot resources, during a deep teardown/rebuild, to a guy they could “write down every day on the lineup card and who [would] give you his best every day without drama, excess noise (i.e., media) and who [would] produce within predictable parameters.” The “yes” arguments tended towards leadership and mentorship, and the “no” towards leveraging every available dollar and roster-spot in service of longer-term payouts.
Markakis proved us all wrong by eclipsing his predicable parameters and going All Star in a season where the Braves started contending a year early. That’s legitimately awesome, but doesn’t change the calculus on Hart’s decision, whether you supported or maligned it originally.
Southcack77
Well-known member
Don’t you even start.