Global Events & Politics Überthread

nsacpi said:
Our direct involvement is unnecessary but it is in our interest to continue supplying arms and intelligence to Israel.
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I also support the use of U.S. assets (in particular anti-missile capabilities in the region) to help defend Israel from these ballistic attacks. There is always a risk that this will lead to attacks on our assets. We can't let fear of escalation dominate every decision of this kind. We have to balance a variety of considerations (including the risk of escalation) and I think on balance there is a strong case not just for providing arms and intelligence to Israel, but to help them intercept these missiles and rockets with our own equipment in the region. As an aside, I think there is an even stronger case to continue providing Ukraine with missile defense systems.
 
mqt said:
Still curious that Netanyahu doesn’t seem to have to worry about pesky things like rules or morals.
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His highest responsibility (and arguably his highest moral responsibility) is to protect his country. And I think a nuclear-armed Iran is something Israel (and the rest of the world) should work very hard to prevent.
 
mqt said:
https://twitter.com/x/status/1933823518413926588

Not propping up Grok as gospel, but maybe both sides are bad?
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nsacpi said:
His highest responsibility (and arguably his highest moral responsibility) is to protect his country. And I think a nuclear-armed Iran is something Israel (and the rest of the world) should work very hard to prevent.
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Indeed. The IRGC hasn’t exactly been coy in its role planning and funding the October 7th attacks. Then you have decades of Iranian leadership making statements like this:

"As the Imam said, Israel must be wiped off the "This regime occupying Jerusalem must vanish from the page of time."
"It is the mission of the Islamic Republic of Iran to erase Israel from the map of the region."
"This sinister regime must be wiped off the map, and this is no longer … a dream (but) it is an achievable goal."
"Operation True Promise 3 will be carried out at the right time, with precision, and on a scale sufficient to destroy Israel and raze Tel Aviv and Haifa to the ground."
"The destruction of Israel is the idea of the Islamic Revolution in Iran and is one of the pillars of the Iranian Islamic regime."

It is rhetoric matched by actions. Every civilian killed in war is a tragedy, but Iran crossed the rubicon years ago.
 
chop2chip said:
Indeed. The IRGC hasn’t exactly been coy in its role planning and funding the October 7th attacks. Then you have decades of Iranian leadership making statements like this:

"As the Imam said, Israel must be wiped off the "This regime occupying Jerusalem must vanish from the page of time."
"It is the mission of the Islamic Republic of Iran to erase Israel from the map of the region."
"This sinister regime must be wiped off the map, and this is no longer … a dream (but) it is an achievable goal."
"Operation True Promise 3 will be carried out at the right time, with precision, and on a scale sufficient to destroy Israel and raze Tel Aviv and Haifa to the ground."
"The destruction of Israel is the idea of the Islamic Revolution in Iran and is one of the pillars of the Iranian Islamic regime."

It is rhetoric matched by actions. Every civilian killed in war is a tragedy, but Iran crossed the rubicon years ago.
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I will also note a few of those quotes were made my IRGC General Salami who was killed in the first wave of strikes.
 
chop2chip said:
Indeed. The IRGC hasn’t exactly been coy in its role planning and funding the October 7th attacks. Then you have decades of Iranian leadership making statements like this:

"As the Imam said, Israel must be wiped off the "This regime occupying Jerusalem must vanish from the page of time."
"It is the mission of the Islamic Republic of Iran to erase Israel from the map of the region."
"This sinister regime must be wiped off the map, and this is no longer … a dream (but) it is an achievable goal."
"Operation True Promise 3 will be carried out at the right time, with precision, and on a scale sufficient to destroy Israel and raze Tel Aviv and Haifa to the ground."
"The destruction of Israel is the idea of the Islamic Revolution in Iran and is one of the pillars of the Iranian Islamic regime."

It is rhetoric matched by actions. Every civilian killed in war is a tragedy, but Iran crossed the rubicon years ago.
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I’m not really objecting to whether or not Israel has a justification for war. I’m objecting to the idea that because Israel has a justification for war that they get to act with impunity and we cannot question whether or not they’re taking effective measures to minimize civilian loss. They failed that test spectacularly in Gaza. Hopefully neither they or Iran do so this time.
 
mqt said:
I’m not really objecting to whether or not Israel has a justification for war. I’m objecting to the idea that because Israel has a justification for war that they get to act with impunity and we cannot question whether or not they’re taking effective measures to minimize civilian loss. They failed that test spectacularly in Gaza. Hopefully neither they or Iran do so this time.
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That’s what happens when your leaders are so chicken shit they hunker down unders schools and the like
 
Tapate50 said:
That’s what happens when your leaders are so chicken shit they hunker down unders schools and the like
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It doesn’t have to, though. Israel still chose to not prioritize the civilians. I have no problem co-blaming Hamas for everything. But chicken shit leaders hunkered down under schools as all of Gaza burns to the ground aren’t the threat to Israeli citizens people pretend they are when defending Israel’s approach to this conflict.
 
mqt said:
I’m not really objecting to whether or not Israel has a justification for war. I’m objecting to the idea that because Israel has a justification for war that they get to act with impunity and we cannot question whether or not they’re taking effective measures to minimize civilian loss. They failed that test spectacularly in Gaza. Hopefully neither they or Iran do so this time.
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The IDF follows the rules of war. They could and should do more to reduce civilian suffering.
 
Oct 7 being a thing kinda proves you wrong.

Israel moved much slower and was way more careful than they should have been. To act like they just shot civilians all Willy Nilly is dumb.

At some point you are taught not to poke the bear.

We can agree to disagree here. There wont be common ground.
 
Tapate50 said:
Oct 7 being a thing kinda proves you wrong.

Israel moved much slower and was way more careful than they should have been. To act like they just shot civilians all Willy Nilly is dumb.

At some point you are taught not to poke the bear.

We can agree to disagree here. There wont be common ground.
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We can agree to disagree overall, but this is still a stupid rebuttal because they weren’t hiding underneath the ruins of Gaza prior to this.
 
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