Heyward to Cubs for less than $200M

holden said:
What an absolute bargain.

So much for saying Heyward would go to the highest bidder. So much for saying he doesn't want to win. So much for saying we actually made a good effort to sign him.

Thank goodness we got that sweet trade for Shelby the other day.. can't imagine how I'd be feeling otherwise.
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Totally overstated
Heyward not getting enough credit for being a savvy businessman

Hey did get the most money. Per all reports I saw he turned down guaranteed money but took the highest yearly value. Went to lower tax state. Cubs will raise marketing profile. Opt outs are worth millions if he plays well

He got the best deal for heyward. Didn't give up anything other than the ego of 200 million on the contract
 
holden said:
What an absolute bargain.

So much for saying Heyward would go to the highest bidder. So much for saying he doesn't want to win. So much for saying we actually made a good effort to sign him.

Thank goodness we got that sweet trade for Shelby the other day.. can't imagine how I'd be feeling otherwise.
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Regardless if the total amount of the deal makes you think we had a shot, you can't underestimate how much those opt outs are worth. We'd never be able to offer one, let alone two. Cubs were in a position to do so.
 
Russ2dollas said:
Totally overstated
Heyward not getting enough credit for being a savvy businessman

Hey did get the most money. Per all reports I saw he turned down guaranteed money but took the highest yearly value. Went to lower tax state. Cubs will raise marketing profile. Opt outs are worth millions if he plays well

He got the best deal for heyward. Didn't give up anything other than the ego of 200 million on the contract
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The opt-outs are huge.

I'm convinced Heyward and Close were determined to test free agency early in Heyward's career and I think the route was pretty clear. The Braves have certainly not done everything right concerning him, but if you have an approximately $100 million budget (give or take) and you're already paying Freeman some pretty hefty coin, you are limited in what you can offer. We can argue all day about whether Heyward should have been the showcase guy and Freeman be low-balled, but that's the proverbial water under the bridge. Heyward was offered pretty much the same contract as Freeman and turned it down. Good decision for him. I don't think it was the Braves necessarily undervaluing Heyward, they were doing what the could within the confines of available resources, which had been considerably dented by the decision to sign Melvin Upton, Jr., and, to a lesser extent, Dan Uggla. Add to that the extensions ladled out by Wren, which were all good decisions when taken individually, and it would have been difficult for us to match what the Cubs (or anyone else) did.

Heyward did well here. I don't think moving him to CF is that solid a plan, but he should hit better in that park, so it will balance out for him. Cubs are basically in the position of the early-1990s Braves here. Nice set of young players and a very fat wallet.
 
He also got two opt-outs. That's a monster sweeter for the deal. When he can take his first opt-out, we should be pretty damn good and he could be a guy we go after...

But, 50poundhead is right, we can't just dish out two 100+ million dollar contract and I personally think that freeman was the right call, there.
 
He got more AAV from Chi than Stl/Was.

Also in 3 years he can opt out, will be 29 if he does as good as some people think he could land a 7/240 deal at 29 years old.

He didnt take less.
 
jpx7 said:
Did Heyward **** your pet turtle or something?
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Nope. I've always been a fan. Have just grown tired of people blowing sunshine up his *ss and acting like he's some kind of god. He's a very good all-around player that's getting paid like something he's not - an elite one. As others have mentioned, he's solid in most phases of the game but the only exceptional thing about him is his defense (which will begin to decline quickly as he ages). He's a good complimentary player on a contending team - not a franchise cornerstone - thus far, not someone you build a team around.

He's a luxury a team without holes like the Cubs can afford. $23 million a year for a currently elite defender and strong baserunner is understandable when you're in their position. A team like the Braves (like many teams have before) would be making a HUGE mistake by investing those resources for him - paying him like the player they hope he can become rather than the player he is. They need power from someone other than Freeman - who admittedly doesn't deliver as much of it as you'd like. IF he could deliver on his promise and become even a 20/20 player, I'd be all for paying him that because his defense would set him apart. The problem is he hasn't. People point to his 2012 season and say "he's CAPABLE of hitting 25 bombs". He's just not. He's a 12-15 HR a year corner OF. There's absolutely nothing wrong with that if you get power from other positions. That's just not enough for the Braves as they're currently constructed.
 
clvclv said:
Nope. I've always been a fan. Have just grown tired of people blowing sunshine up his *ss and acting like he's some kind of god. He's a very good all-around player that's getting paid like something he's not - an elite one. As others have mentioned, he's solid in most phases of the game but the only exceptional thing about him is his defense which will begin to decline quickly as he ages. He's a good complimentary player on a contending team - not a franchise cornerstone - thus far, not someone you build a team around.

He's a luxury a team without holes like the Cubs can afford. $23 million a year for a currently elite defender and strong baserunner is understandable when you're in their position. A team like the Braves (like many teams have before) would be making a HUGE mistake by investing those resources for him - paying him like the player they hope he can become rather than the player he is. They need power from someone other than Freeman - who admittedly doesn't deliver as much of it as you'd like. IF he could deliver on his promise and become even a 20/20 player, I'd be all for paying him that because his defense would set him apart. The problem is he hasn't. People point to his 2012 season and say "he's CAPABLE of hitting 25 bombs". He's just not. He's a 12-15 HR a year corner OF. There's absolutely nothing wrong with that if you get power from other positions. That's just not enough for the Braves as they're currently constructed.
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Bingo and im not even sure he would have signed with the Braves if they offered that.

I think he and his agent were intent on testing FA.
 
holden said:
What an absolute bargain.

So much for saying Heyward would go to the highest bidder. So much for saying he doesn't want to win. So much for saying we actually made a good effort to sign him.

Thank goodness we got that sweet trade for Shelby the other day.. can't imagine how I'd be feeling otherwise.
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From all reports, he not only went to the highest bidder (the AAV was apparently the highest of the three finalists), he also went to the one that built in opt-outs so he can ditch them in 3 or 4 years for even more money if salaries continue to grow (just like Greinke did). There's nothing wrong with that - my guess is we'd all do the same if we were in his shoes.

The weirdest thing about the situation to me was hearing livid Cards fans calling in to the radio shows yesterday. I was really surprised so many of them took it so hard. The vast majority of them handled Pujols' departure better.
 
There's no denying Heyward is a very good player. He got paid more for hype and potential then actual production but again he's a very good all around player. The problem is a team with payroll constraints like the Braves CANNOT pay guys over $20M a year unless they are a true impact bat or top of the rotation starter. We can't afford coughing up that much money for a guy that hasn't shown the ability to carry a team. Heyward is a perfect secondary piece to a contender and that's why he's so great for a big market team like the cubs. If we gave Heyward $23M for 8 years and he didn't improve a good deal offensively this organization would be in trouble.

There's no denying the fact that I would love nothing more then for Heyward to have been a lifelong Brave. But given the state of the team at the time, I'm thrilled what we've turned him into. I'll take Swanson, Blair, Inciarte, Jenkins.
 
emk418 said:
There's no denying Heyward is a very good player. He got paid more for hype and potential then actual production but again he's a very good all around player. The problem is a team with payroll constraints like the Braves CANNOT pay guys over $20M a year unless they are a true impact bat or top of the rotation starter. We can't afford coughing up that much money for a guy that hasn't shown the ability to carry a team. Heyward is a perfect secondary piece to a contender and that's why he's so great for a big market team like the cubs. If we gave Heyward $23M for 8 years and he didn't improve a good deal offensively this organization would be in trouble.

There's no denying the fact that I would love nothing more then for Heyward to have been a lifelong Brave. But given the state of the team at the time, I'm thrilled what we've turned him into. I'll take Swanson, Blair, Inciarte, Jenkins.
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Heyward didn't get paid for hype.

People don't get this because it's a hard concept, but Heyward got paid because he's talented, he got paid "more" than some anticipated because he's so young.

I'm gonna just type the ages of the top 20 FA according to ESPN

26
32
30
28
30
31
29
29
29
31
28
37
30
32
28
31
29
29
30
30

If you notice, most premium FA are in their late 20s/early 30s. Heyward is in his mid 20s. Which means come year 8, he may still be a productive player. Odds aren't that high that in year 6 or 7 of their respective deals, Greinke and Price won't be productive.
 
BRule said:
LET'S GET IT STARTED...........IN HERRRRRRREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE..................

That's what the Cubs got him for, you have no idea how much less we could have signed him for if had actually made a real attempt to sign him.
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You're right we don't know. Just like you have no idea if he and his agent simply wanted to test FA the entire time.

But all that is irrelevant. I'm glad we never offered Heyward a big extension. I'd much rather have Jenkins, Inciarte, Blair, and Swanson over the next several years than Heyward.

And for as much as you whine about how great Heyward is, Inciarte is a pretty similar player who was worth over 5 wins last year. So essentially we are getting a a very similar player for a fraction of the contract Heyward is getting.
 
BRule said:
LET'S GET IT STARTED...........IN HERRRRRRREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE..................

That's what the Cubs got him for, you have no idea how much less we could have signed him for if had actually made a real attempt to sign him.
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Said it many times, firmly believe he and his agent wanted to test FA the whole time.

If i knew his bat would be elite, sure, but even still. Having Jenkins, Blair, Incierte lesser version of Heyward, and Swanson for one year of Heyward is hard to pass up.

Dont think a team like the Braves with a limited payroll can offer that. He's a perfect fit to the Cubs, wont have to be a huge part of the team on offense with guys like Bryant, Rizzo, Schwarber, maybe Soler, etc.
 
zitothebrave said:
Heyward didn't get paid for hype.

People don't get this because it's a hard concept, but Heyward got paid because he's talented, he got paid "more" than some anticipated because he's so young.

I'm gonna just type the ages of the top 20 FA according to ESPN

26
32
30
28
30
31
29
29
29
31
28
37
30
32
28
31
29
29
30
30

If you notice, most premium FA are in their late 20s/early 30s. Heyward is in his mid 20s. Which means come year 8, he may still be a productive player. Odds aren't that high that in year 6 or 7 of their respective deals, Greinke and Price won't be productive.
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The age is the kicker, players Heyward's age almost never hit FA in baseball.
 
holden said:
What an absolute bargain.

So much for saying Heyward would go to the highest bidder. So much for saying he doesn't want to win. So much for saying we actually made a good effort to sign him.

Thank goodness we got that sweet trade for Shelby the other day.. can't imagine how I'd be feeling otherwise.
Click to expand...

I'd hardly call this deal a bargain. May be in relation to the Nats offer, but even still, he simply took the offer with the highest annual value and is still got one of the 12 richest contracts in baseball. That's hardly a bargain.
 
Russ2dollas said:
Totally overstated

Heyward not getting enough credit for being a savvy businessman

Hey did get the most money. Per all reports I saw he turned down guaranteed money but took the highest yearly value. Went to lower tax state. Cubs will raise marketing profile. Opt outs are worth millions if he plays well

He got the best deal for heyward. Didn't give up anything other than the ego of 200 million on the contract
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This
 
Heyward said:
The age is the kicker, players Heyward's age almost never hit FA in baseball.
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And that's a healthy part of his value. Similar to when Fielder was a FA. Fielder got paid almost as much as Pujols, and wasn't even remotely close to Pujols on a skill level. But him being 4 years younger played into his value.
 
clvclv said:
He's a good complimentary player on a contending team - not a franchise cornerstone - thus far, not someone you build a team around.
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The Cardinals were arguably the best team in baseball last year, and he was their best player. He was also better than anyone the Royals had.
 
smootness said:
The Cardinals were arguably the best team in baseball last year, and he was their best player. He was also better than anyone the Royals had.
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Regarding the Royals, Alex Gordon and Heyward are very very compareable players, Gordon is just older. Lorenzo Cain is also really good.

I wouldnt say he's a complimentery player but he's not a guy you have as your #3 guy on a mid-market team. Maybe his offense improves now but he's perfect on a team like Chicago where he wont be asked to be THE guy.

Regarding the Cardinals, he had a really nice year, Cardinals had alot of injuries and as we know most of his WAR comes from defense/base running, not a bad thing mind you.
 
Gordon and Cain are comparable, sure. All I'm saying is that he's more than a complementary player on any team and that he absolutely can be a franchise cornerstone.
 
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