Next Move?

To me a SP, and 2 position prospects would be needed. De Leon, Pederson, and Guerrero/Peraza and I'd add Mallex in. With Pederson, Mallex is expendable.
 
Hudson2 said:
I'd bet Seager is a no go. Urias, Pederson, Guerrero, Peraza, De Leon are all the players that would have to be in play imo. I'd want 2 from that group and I'd add a piece if we needed. Urias, Pederson, and Guerrero for Miller and Mallex would be ideal. We get a power hitting cf'er, a stud starting pitching prospect, and our 3b back.
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lol at Urias for Miller.
 
emk418 said:
You're not getting Joc Pederson plus De Leon.
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Exactly. I think a lot of our fans' value for Miller is inflated. We should be ecstatic if we got Pederson alone for Miller. There's no way we're getting Seager or Urias at all, and guys like Pederson and De Leon would have to be straight-up trades, if that's even possible.

We won't get an elite prospect, and we won't get anything more than one very good one. Our options are probably something like one very good one and nothing else, two good prospects, or a couple pretty good major league pieces.

Miller has good value, but no one is going to view him as an ace. People seem to be expecting an ace return.
 
You saw the Braves asked for Pollock. Yeah they were turned down but I'm glad the Braves are asking that much bc we don't have to trade him. If somebody wants him they're gonna have to over pay. And if the Dodgers miss out on Price and Greinke then I can see them overpaying for pitching.
 
smootness said:
Exactly. I think a lot of our fans' value for Miller is inflated. We should be ecstatic if we got Pederson alone for Miller. There's no way we're getting Seager or Urias at all, and guys like Pederson and De Leon would have to be straight-up trades, if that's even possible.

We won't get an elite prospect, and we won't get anything more than one very good one. Our options are probably something like one very good one and nothing else, two good prospects, or a couple pretty good major league pieces.

Miller has good value, but no one is going to view him as an ace. People seem to be expecting an ace return.
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Well I disagree with your value of Shelby. If we trade him and had a smarter front office we would get a big return. My point is your not getting a potential superstar power CF in Joc PLUS a top 20 overall prospect in De Leon for Shelby. You're not going to get a guy like Joc who just finished his rookie season. But a package like De Leon, Verdugo etc is reasonable. Or you're looking at a guy like Puig who has similar contractual control.
 
Hudson2 said:
You saw the Braves asked for Pollock. Yeah they were turned down but I'm glad the Braves are asking that much bc we don't have to trade him. If somebody wants him they're gonna have to over pay. And if the Dodgers miss out on Price and Greinke then I can see them overpaying for pitching.
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Oh, no doubt. I'm definitely glad we're asking for a lot and unwilling to trade him unless their demands are met as of now. I'm just saying that if we're to trade him, we probably won't get as much as some of our fans seem to expect. I'm guessing that once a deal is made (I firmly believe at least one of Teheran/Miller will be traded this offseason), many of our fans will be angry about the return, but we just have to be a little more realistic.
 
emk418 said:
Well I disagree with your value of Shelby. If we trade him and had a smarter front office we would get a big return. My point is your not getting a potential superstar power CF in Joc PLUS a top 20 overall prospect in De Leon for Shelby. You're not going to get a guy like Joc who just finished his rookie season. But a package like De Leon, Verdugo etc is reasonable. Or you're looking at a guy like Puig who has similar contractual control.
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It seems like we pretty much agree, so I'm not sure what you disagree with.

But saying 'if we had a smarter front office' is kind of weird...his value is what it is. No one is going to give up a ton for him just because a 'smarter' front office demands they give more.
 
emk418 said:
De Leon, Verdugo, and Barnes for Shelby. Then sign me up
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Mentioned that one several days ago. Would prefer Mazara though if push came to shove. Think he has a really good chance to become Heyward with a little less defense but more power - probably the only guy out there I'd personally trade Shelby straight-up for (that is actually attainable).
 
smootness said:
Exactly. I think a lot of our fans' value for Miller is inflated. We should be ecstatic if we got Pederson alone for Miller. There's no way we're getting Seager or Urias at all, and guys like Pederson and De Leon would have to be straight-up trades, if that's even possible.

We won't get an elite prospect, and we won't get anything more than one very good one. Our options are probably something like one very good one and nothing else, two good prospects, or a couple pretty good major league pieces.

Miller has good value, but no one is going to view him as an ace. People seem to be expecting an ace return.
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Miller WILL net an elite prospect, but only one.

As you mention, he's not an "Ace", but if a true contender that has one could slot him in as a #2/#3, he'll easily be worth the price. For example...

Texas: Darvish/Hamels/Miller (would leave them the money to chase Cespedes)

Dodgers: Kershaw/Greinke or Price/Miller (money??? HA)

Pittsburgh: Cole/Liriano/Miller (would leave them the money to look for a 1B upgrade or sign Zobrist)

Cubs: Arrieta/Lester/Miller (would leave them the money to sign Heyward if they traded Soler)

Cards: Wainright/Wacha/Miller (would leave them the money to re-sign Heyward or sign Davis)
 
smootness said:
Exactly. I think a lot of our fans' value for Miller is inflated. We should be ecstatic if we got Pederson alone for Miller. There's no way we're getting Seager or Urias at all, and guys like Pederson and De Leon would have to be straight-up trades, if that's even possible.

We won't get an elite prospect, and we won't get anything more than one very good one. Our options are probably something like one very good one and nothing else, two good prospects, or a couple pretty good major league pieces.

Miller has good value, but no one is going to view him as an ace. People seem to be expecting an ace return.
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why.. 11th best ERA, 24th in Whip, 17th in Ks, and pitched 200+ innings.. That is not best in baseball good but for a 24 year old pitcher, who did that his rookie year too, is pretty special. I would say get what you want or keep the guy.. because he will be good...you also
 
Yeah I said if we wanted more we could add to it. I know you're not getting all of that for Miller alone. Pederson would be my main target though and I think they'd do it.
 
Those Shanks trades are the epitome of the 'throw in a bunch of crap nobody wants so we can get legitimate talent' kind of deals a lot of fans throw out. The Astros would laugh in our face over that Freeman offer.

The others aren't as bad as that one, but I still think they're overly optimistic.

Guys like Perez, Cabrera, Lien, Garcia, Camargo, and Hursh are worth pretty close to nothing. They don't add any real value in those deals.
 
Let's just all agree shanks is an idiot and leave it at that. They are all terribly lopsided wins for the Braves. He seems to think lumping a few zero value organizational fillers with a real MLB asset will somehow double the return from the other team.

I'm shocked anyone still pays for his "premium" content.
 
Enscheff said:
Let's just all agree shanks is an idiot and leave it at that. They are all terribly lopsided wins for the Braves. He seems to think lumping a few zero value organizational fillers with a real MLB asset will somehow double the return from the other team.

I'm shocked anyone still pays for his "premium" content.
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None of his trades would be accepted. That being said, I like his idea of trading more of our current talent for future talent. None of those trades would be so lopsided, but the lose framework makes sense.
 
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