Well my online baseball exposure is limited to this forum and reddit. But homers will be homers. There is truth that Acuna's steals are what's going to land him the MVP. But not for the reasons some may think.
Ronald Acuna Jr. 40-40 Club
- Thread starter AJonesATL
- Start date
Well my online baseball exposure is limited to this forum and reddit. But homers will be homers. There is truth that Acuna's steals are what's going to land him the MVP. But not for the reasons some may think.
SJ24
New member
This is correct. Enscheff belongs in a front office crunching numbers somewhere. A team would win ball games with him.
That said, he gets way off track with the social, political, and economic commentary.
I mean, no **** a Braves fan is going to pump up Acuna.
bravesfanMatt
Steve Harvey'd
If he is cranking 60 homers then I doubt he sniffs 60 steals. Probably 60/40 if he hits more homers. But I would rather it be 60/20 and just have the threat of the stolen base.
It's so bizarre to me that Enscheff is so on this Mookie playing 2B thing.
I can't tell if Enscheff has watched more Dodgers games than Braves games this year, because of the way he just can't stop raving about Betts being able to play 2B, and that's somehow the tiebreaker over Acuña in winning the MVP.
Enscheff: Why are grown men here so obsessed about an accomplishment they have nothing to do with, and want to see Acuña win the MVP so badly.
Also Enscheff: Mookie Betts plays exceptional 2B, the defensive value alone is why he should be MVP.
This may be another another instance of gilesfan being a closet Nats fan while pretending to be a Braves fan. Dodgers are the team and org that does almost everything Scheff wants and obsesses over.
I can't tell if Enscheff has watched more Dodgers games than Braves games this year, because of the way he just can't stop raving about Betts being able to play 2B, and that's somehow the tiebreaker over Acuña in winning the MVP.
Enscheff: Why are grown men here so obsessed about an accomplishment they have nothing to do with, and want to see Acuña win the MVP so badly.
Also Enscheff: Mookie Betts plays exceptional 2B, the defensive value alone is why he should be MVP.
This may be another another instance of gilesfan being a closet Nats fan while pretending to be a Braves fan. Dodgers are the team and org that does almost everything Scheff wants and obsesses over.
zitothebrave
Connoisseur of Minors
What's truly amazing about Acuna is he's been unlucky. His xwOBA is .465, 37 points higher then the next player, Shohei. Looking back at all 9 seasons of xwOBA and see the season leaders in xwOBA are
Acuna .465
Judge .463
Harper .430
Soto .470 Covid season only played 47 games
Trout .460
Trout .435
Judge .450
Cabrera .449
Cabrera .432
Acuna is having one of the best offensive seasons in hte last decade Only COVID season Soto has a higher xwOBA. Kicker is too some of those guys had their wOBA right in line. Many of those guys were MVPs or were robbed of an MVP (2017 Judge) so it's interesting, also some of those leaders were guys who had some health issues and didn't play 150 so sampling is a bit of an issue. But the point still stands that Acuna has the best xwOBA season with 150+ games played. We're witnessing something awesome this year. Something almost as awesome as Judge last year. But the WAR truthers are willing to die on the hill that Mookie is more valuable while not even acknowledging issues with defensive metrics.
Acuna .465
Judge .463
Harper .430
Soto .470 Covid season only played 47 games
Trout .460
Trout .435
Judge .450
Cabrera .449
Cabrera .432
Acuna is having one of the best offensive seasons in hte last decade Only COVID season Soto has a higher xwOBA. Kicker is too some of those guys had their wOBA right in line. Many of those guys were MVPs or were robbed of an MVP (2017 Judge) so it's interesting, also some of those leaders were guys who had some health issues and didn't play 150 so sampling is a bit of an issue. But the point still stands that Acuna has the best xwOBA season with 150+ games played. We're witnessing something awesome this year. Something almost as awesome as Judge last year. But the WAR truthers are willing to die on the hill that Mookie is more valuable while not even acknowledging issues with defensive metrics.
Strike3urout
Active member
xwOBA is useful to assess a player’s ability and forward expectations, but less useful to assess past value. You have to go with actual results. Outs are outs, even if they have an expected BA of .900. That Acuna has been unlucky this season is bonkers, but it shouldn’t add to his MVP resume.
I think the argument boils down to the fact that Acuna and Betts are so close with respect to their overall value that they‘re almost indistinguishable. Acuna has been the better offensive player. Betts is the better defender, and gets the additional benefit of helping out at a position of need for his team. That has a lot of value, whether you want to rate his defense at 2B as elite or merely competent. Ronald scores well with the traditionalists, who value the counting stats as well as being „the best player on the best team“.
Of course I‘m rooting for Ronald to take it, but if I had no emotional attachment to either player, I‘d say you can’t go wrong either way.
Tapate50
Well-known member
Sounds like we got a Commie in our midst. Whats the 2023 version of Red Dawn look like?
Most WAR truthers don't even know that double plays are the difference between Acuna'sand Mookie's WAR value. He's literally being penalized for hitting rockets at people with a ton of people on base due to the Braves deep lineup.
zitothebrave
Connoisseur of Minors
Acuna need to swipe 3 more bags to become the modern era leader for the braves in stolen bases. On the less likely but still possible he needs 23 total bases to pass Hank as our single season leader. Another less likely but still possible is he needs 11 times on base to set the single season record passing 99 Chipper.
Acuna is having arguably the best offensive season of any Brave ever. That's including the back in the day crowd when they played against scrubs and only white people.
Acuna is having arguably the best offensive season of any Brave ever. That's including the back in the day crowd when they played against scrubs and only white people.
Maybe Chipper was right. He's the most talented Brave ever.
bravesfanMatt
Steve Harvey'd
I am still in favor of a no slide rule for the next 4 games. No injuries trying to get meaningless bases. persoanl accomplishments should not be put infront of the overall team goal.. Losing Acuna for the postseason because he is trying to break some meaningless record would piss me off. There are countless ways to get hurt on the field.. no need to increase those odds by doing stupid things. This includes Wash as well.. don't send if it will be even close. station to station.
All timer. MVP
I might be a homer, but for me I just don't see how you give Betts the MVP over Acuna. The argument for Betts is that he's "arguably" been "slightly" better because of his defensive value, and even in that example its extremely close.
You can just as easily argue Acuna has been slightly better statistically without getting into expected stats. I'm not one for narratives coming into play. But if its as close as its been, then at that point I don't see how you don't take into account that 1.) he is having a historic never been done before season, 2.) his counting stats are just better basically across the board, 3.) best player on best team, 4.) all of his more super-advanced metrics truly just show his level of hitting metrics frankly blows away Betts - and everybody! - no one gives MVP based off expected stats, but if the base line stats are basically equal, then it doesn't hurt to at least be aware that he simply hits the ball harder and better than anyone in the game and its not close, 5.) when its as close as it is, I don't think its unreasonable to just consider that Acuna is simply doing things no one else in the game can do all around - Baseball is a game of history. Ronald is making history. 40-70 just matters - in the history of the game, 40-70 just matters.
I'd also add that sports are about competition. You don't settle things based off small sample sizes, but in the most raw, competitive juice form, there is at least something to be said that Acuna was the runaway MVP, Betts went bonkers and for a few weeks the media narrative was Betts had "stolen it" - they then go ahead to ahead in a critical series with HF on the line, and Braves take 3 of 4, with Acuna just showing out and then just seizing it back in September. Everyone in the baseball world knew they were both gunning for MVP in September and Acuna busted out another gear. Not quite the same, but shades of Chipper in 1999. Again, you don't decide MVP's on that if Betts was just better, but when its this close, things like that matter. That is just the nature of sports, its not always just decided on the excel sheet.
Lastly consistency matters. Acuna hasn't been a tale of all or nothing. He's gone over a 900 ops every month of the season. Betts has a 760 ops in September, and 767 in April. I know that means at his best, he's also been beyond absurd, but being elite every game of the season to me is not insignificant.
Again - everything I just spoke about I would 100% write-off if Betts had simply been better. But even if you fall in the camp of thinking Betts has been better, its so razor thin, that with everything else going for Acuna, I just don't know how you don't vote for Acuna. Historic season that will live in the record books.
I might be a homer, but for me I just don't see how you give Betts the MVP over Acuna. The argument for Betts is that he's "arguably" been "slightly" better because of his defensive value, and even in that example its extremely close.
You can just as easily argue Acuna has been slightly better statistically without getting into expected stats. I'm not one for narratives coming into play. But if its as close as its been, then at that point I don't see how you don't take into account that 1.) he is having a historic never been done before season, 2.) his counting stats are just better basically across the board, 3.) best player on best team, 4.) all of his more super-advanced metrics truly just show his level of hitting metrics frankly blows away Betts - and everybody! - no one gives MVP based off expected stats, but if the base line stats are basically equal, then it doesn't hurt to at least be aware that he simply hits the ball harder and better than anyone in the game and its not close, 5.) when its as close as it is, I don't think its unreasonable to just consider that Acuna is simply doing things no one else in the game can do all around - Baseball is a game of history. Ronald is making history. 40-70 just matters - in the history of the game, 40-70 just matters.
I'd also add that sports are about competition. You don't settle things based off small sample sizes, but in the most raw, competitive juice form, there is at least something to be said that Acuna was the runaway MVP, Betts went bonkers and for a few weeks the media narrative was Betts had "stolen it" - they then go ahead to ahead in a critical series with HF on the line, and Braves take 3 of 4, with Acuna just showing out and then just seizing it back in September. Everyone in the baseball world knew they were both gunning for MVP in September and Acuna busted out another gear. Not quite the same, but shades of Chipper in 1999. Again, you don't decide MVP's on that if Betts was just better, but when its this close, things like that matter. That is just the nature of sports, its not always just decided on the excel sheet.
Lastly consistency matters. Acuna hasn't been a tale of all or nothing. He's gone over a 900 ops every month of the season. Betts has a 760 ops in September, and 767 in April. I know that means at his best, he's also been beyond absurd, but being elite every game of the season to me is not insignificant.
Again - everything I just spoke about I would 100% write-off if Betts had simply been better. But even if you fall in the camp of thinking Betts has been better, its so razor thin, that with everything else going for Acuna, I just don't know how you don't vote for Acuna. Historic season that will live in the record books.
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bravesfanMatt
Steve Harvey'd
I am saying all the starters. No one can slide or dive..
This the best example of failed reading comprehension I’ve seen in a while. Well done.
Now this is a guy demonstrating adult level reading comprehension. He is correct. Acuna almost certainly wins MVP, but it isn’t the slam dunk some Braves homers claim.