Russia Collusion Scandal (aka A Leftist fantasy)

thethe said:
If you want to start building positive relations with a key world power without the obvious backlash from a desperate administration looking to keeps its skeletons in yhe closest then yes it's a good move.

We need Russia to play ball on iran/korea/Islamic terrorism. I know you've rejected that notion in the past ad you're entitled to that belief but that is what I'd happening in my opinion.

Even the article linked by nsacpi discusses the case of collusion by establishing this long Web of financial contacts and yet the papa case is of a beginning point in a relationship between the trump campaign and russia. So which is it?
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I think there are two somewhat separate issues here. Not completely separate but it is helpful to think of them as distinct. One is any financial relationship(s) that existed between Trump and the Russians prior to the campaign.

The second is the intricate dance that occurred over the course of the campaign that led the two parties to develop a symbiotic relationship. Russian help in various forms including leaking the hacked emails. The Trump campaign changing the GOP platform on Ukraine and holding out the prospect of an easing of sanctions. This intricate dance had many facets, one of which was the use of Papadopoulos as a point of contact.
 
nsacpi said:
I think there are two somewhat separate issues here. Not completely separate but it is helpful to think of them as distinct. One is any financial relationship(s) that existed between Trump and the Russians prior to the campaign.

The second is the intricate dance that occurred over the course of the campaign that led the two parties to develop a symbiotic relationship. Russian help in various forms including leaking the hacked emails. The Trump campaign changing the GOP platform on Ukraine and holding out the prospect of an easing of sanctions. This intricate dance had many facets, one of which was the use of Papadopoulos as point of contact.
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But why papa when the contention is that these relationships existed prior to trump even deciding to run for office? Again. The communications with papa would not be phrased as an opening invitation. Just my two cents and a point I think pokes a hole in the financial dependency angle that is being made.
 
thethe said:
But why papa when the contention is that these relationships existed prior to trump even deciding to run for office? Again. The communications with papa would not be phrased as an opening invitation. Just my two cents and a point I think pokes a hole in the financial dependency angle that is being made.
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Why Papa? Well I think it was an open question from the Russians point of view as to which approach would prove to be the most productive. So Papa was one. The "adoption lawyer" was another. Peter W Smith another. They've continued to bang on the door since the elections, with approaches being made via Hope Hicks. I think they are very thorough and just because one approach seems redundant does not mean it might not produce value down the line.
 
nsacpi said:
Politics makes for strange bedfellows. It wasn't so long ago that Trump loved CNN and hated FOX.
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If MSM ceased thi's destructive path they are currently on it would be for the good of all of us. They ultimate parents of these companies have alterior motives however.
 
nsacpi said:
Why Papa? Well I think it was an open question from the Russians point of view as to which approach would prove to be the most productive. So Papa was one. The "adoption lawyer" was another. They've continued to bang on the door since the elections, with approaches being made via Hope Hicks. I think they are very thorough and just because one approach seems redundant does not mean it might not produce value down the line.
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So what if the financial dependency angle? What's the end game with researching this?
 
thethe said:
So what if the financial dependency angle? What's the end game with researching this?
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For me there are two things of interest:

1) Whether Mueller uncovers financial crimes committed by Trump and/or Kushner in the course of his investigation.

2) Whether he uncovers information that shows Trump is financially dependent upon Russians. Even if there is no crime involved, I think something like that is worth bringing to the public's attention.

Actually, it is also possible he is pursuing a much different angle that is more closely related to the campaign. For example, looking at any payments made to the hackers.
 
thethe said:
If MSM ceased thi's destructive path they are currently on it would be for the good of all of us. They ultimate parents of these companies have alterior motives however.
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I wasn't happy with CNN's coverage of the primaries. But I accept than none of us will be happy with how the media covers politics.
 
thethe said:
If you want to start building positive relations with a key world power without the obvious backlash from a desperate administration looking to keeps its skeletons in yhe closest then yes it's a good move.

We need Russia to play ball on iran/korea/Islamic terrorism. I know you've rejected that notion in the past ad you're entitled to that belief but that is what I'd happening in my opinion.

Even the article linked by nsacpi discusses the case of collusion by establishing this long Web of financial contacts and yet the papa case is of a beginning point in a relationship between the trump campaign and russia. So which is it?
Click to expand...

I'm just going to repeat: suggesting using Russian embassy secure facilities to communicate directly with the Russian government, for the express purpose of avoiding US intelligence oversight, is not a good idea, under any circumstances.

Even if your motives are entirely pure, you cannot plausibly defend yourself from the appearance of wrongdoing . . . which is precisely why you don't do dumb **** like that. Suggesting it is ludicrous, and defending it is ludicrous.
 
Julio3000 said:
I'm just going to repeat: suggesting using Russian embassy secure facilities to communicate directly with the Russian government, for the express purpose of avoiding US intelligence oversight, is not a good idea, under any circumstances.

Even if your motives are entirely pure, you cannot plausibly defend yourself from the appearance of wrongdoing . . . which is precisely why you don't do dumb **** like that. Suggesting it is ludicrous, and defending it is ludicrous.
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I would say there is a good chance the motives were in fact sinister.
 
Julio3000 said:
I'm just going to repeat: suggesting using Russian embassy secure facilities to communicate directly with the Russian government, for the express purpose of avoiding US intelligence oversight, is not a good idea, under any circumstances.

Even if your motives are entirely pure, you cannot plausibly defend yourself from the appearance of wrongdoing . . . which is precisely why you don't do dumb **** like that. Suggesting it is ludicrous, and defending it is ludicrous.
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After learning about the techniques of the Obama administration I don't blame trumps transition team at all. He is in line to be leader of the free world. If he wants to have secret meetings with other leaders aND ensure that information is not deceminated outside of a select circle then that is his right and what the American people should expect from any president.
 
thethe said:
After learning about the techniques of the Obama administration I don't blame trumps transition team at all. He is in line to be leader of the free world. If he wants to have secret meetings with other leaders aND ensure that information is not deceminated outside of a select circle then that is his right and what the American people should expect from any president.
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no, it isn't his "right" until he is inaugurated. In fact, as a private citizen which he was until being sworn in, it is illegal.

There is no constitutional status of or privilege afforded a President-Elect.
Unless granted by the sitting President
Perhaps there should be, but, there isn't
...............

You constantly confuse "rights" with what you perceive to be obligations / responsibilities / privileges
Stop using that word
 
thethe said:
[tw]947482989176516608[/tw]
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Can you prove where the "dossier" has been wrong ?
It is being used as a jumping off point or verification by (R) congressional investigators.

What have you perceived correctly in this scandal.
You have been wrong at every turn
 
57Brave said:
no, it isn't his "right" until he is inaugurated. In fact, as a private citizen, it is illegal.

There is no constitutional status of President-Elect.

Perhaps there should be, but, there isn't

...............

You constantly confuse "rights" with what you perceive to be obligations / responsibilities / privileges

Stop using that word
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Haha....more logan act nonsense. Have fun with that. The people give power to the leaders in this country and that happens on November 8th.
 
57Brave said:
Can you prove where the "dossier" has been wrong ?

It is being used as a jumping off point or verification by (R) congressional investigators.

What have you perceived correctly in this scandal.

You have been wrong at every turn
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The dossier has been largely unverified. Do you disagree with almost all professionals assessment?
 
thethe said:
The dossier has been largely unverified. Do you disagree with almost all professionals assessment?
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I would worry less about 57 or some other poster agreeing with the pros than about our president continuing to taking Putin's word that there was no interference.
 
nsacpi said:
I would worry less about 57 or some other poster agreeing with the pros than about our president continuing to taking Putin's word that there was no interference.
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Are we now assuming trump speaks the truth? Did you think his contention is just playing political game?
 
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