the CIA torture report is sickening

[zitothebrave]

Here's what Senator and guy who was severely tortured in Vietnam John mcCann ahd to say about Waterboarding "They [other presidential candidates] should know what it is. It is not a complicated procedure. It is torture."

 

[Garmel]

Makes me so proud

*yawn* I'm more worried about the fact that these butchers are still beheading innocent Christians.

 

[Garmel]

Just don't mind me, guys. I'm just drunk and being an ass. I'll probably apologize tomorrow to all of you when I'm sober tomorrow.

 

[goldfly]

let's look at the big cases that said the use of the torture known as waterboarding worked:

José Padilla, who was accused of plotting a radiological dirty bomb attack inside the United States, was one of the first American citizens designated an “enemy combatant.” The Bush administration credited the interrogation of Abu Zubaydah with uncovering the plot and leading investigators to Mr. Padilla. His arrest has been held up for years as proof that waterboarding and other tactics worked.

COMMITTEE’S CONCLUSION
But Abu Zubaydah's information on Mr. Padilla was sketchy, and he provided it well before he was waterboarded. Mr. Padilla, in fact, was arrested in May 2002, three months before the C.I.A. interrogation program began.

For all the publicity the Bush administration gave Mr. Padilla, the committee revealed that the government never took his dirty bomb plot seriously. It was based on a satirical Internet article titled “How to Make an H-Bomb,” and the plot involved swinging a bucket full of uranium over one's head for 45 minutes. One internal C.I.A. email declared that such a plot would most likely kill Mr. Padilla but “would definitely not result in a nuclear explosive device.” Another called Mr. Padilla “a petty criminal” and described the dirty bomb plot as “lore.”

Weeks later, when Khalid Shaikh Mohammed — after being subjected to waterboarding — discussed the Karachi plot, it came as no surprise to C.I.A. officials, who again reported that they already knew about it.

But the committee report shows that the C.I.A. knew that Al Qaeda had targeted Heathrow months before Mr. Mohammed was captured and waterboarded. The plot was labeled “not imminent” because Al Qaeda had not identified pilots for the mission. And the plot was disrupted in full with the capture of Ramzi bin al-Shibh, Mr. Mohammed and others.

Capture of Ramzi bin al-Shibh
THE CASE
The Bush administration said that the capture of Abu Zubaydah and his subsequent interrogation, which included waterboarding, led to the capture of Mr. bin al-Shibh, another senior Qaeda operative. A senior C.I.A. official told Congress that Abu Zubaydah “led us to Ramzi bin al-Shibh.”

COMMITTEE’S CONCLUSION
The committee report found no evidence of that. “C.I.A. records indicate that Ramzi bin al-Shibh was captured unexpectedly” during raids in Pakistan in which authorities were searching for someone else. While C.I.A. cables indicate that Abu Zubaydah did reveal information on Mr. bin al-Shibh during his waterboarding, interrogation reports cited by the committee revealed that Abu Zubaydah had already revealed that information to the F.B.I. — without being tortured.

not only is it torture

it did no real good either

 

[goldfly]

*yawn* I'm more worried about the fact that these butchers are still beheading innocent Christians.

wow

 

[goldfly]

“In the spring of 2004, after two detainees were transferred to CIA custody, CIA interrogators proposed, and CIA Headquarters approved, using the CIA’s enhanced interrogation techniques on one of the two detainees because it might cause the detainee to provide information that could identify inconsistencies in the other detainee’s story. After both detainees had spent approximately 24 hours shackled in the standing sleep deprivation position, CIA Headquarters confirmed that the detainees were former CIA sources. The two detainees had tried to contact the CIA on multiple occasions prior to their detention to inform the CIA of their activities and provide intelligence. "[Page 133]

tortured people that helped us too

 

[Hawk]

Richard Posner: "If torture is the only means of obtaining the information necessary to prevent the detonation of a nuclear bomb in Times Square, torture should be used - and will be used - to obtain the information. ... no one who doubts that this is the case should be in a position of responsibility."

 

[goldfly]

@vplus: Former CIA top lawyer John Rizzo on fear of arrest overseas over CIA interrogation program: "yeah, I'm concerned."

 

[BedellBrave]

Put me down with being opposed to abortion and torture.

 

[57Brave]

Richard Posner: "If torture is the only means of obtaining the information necessary to prevent the detonation of a nuclear bomb in Times Square, torture should be used - and will be used - to obtain the information. ... no one who doubts that this is the case should be in a position of responsibility."

I guess we can justify anything. After all we have people justifying the choking to death of an unarmed citizen by police in broad daylight.
Virtually the same people that can justify the use of rectal feeding

 

[BedellBrave]

Put me down with being against abortion, torture, the determination of the GJ in the Garner case, the burning and looting in Ferguson, racism, and the militarization of police forces.

 

[BedellBrave]

Now, I welcome others to join me.

 

[57Brave]

Well Im against the Designated Hitter too ! I find it as relevant to this conversation as abortion.

Why is it, every time a redstater finds themselves on the short end of a political / current events discussion they think they get to use abortion as their trump card.

Fact of the matter -- no one is for abortion.

Just like no one is for appendectomy or knee replacement.

I respect one's view as far as it affects their family. But in this case I dont see where this has anything to do with the discussion.
We are talking about our government going across the world torturing people then lying about it.

Hysterectomy or vasectomy. Against them too .
Just like abortion

 

[Hawk]

I guess we can justify anything.

How can man truly justify any action that results in the taking of another's life?

Self-defense? Lex talionis?

 

[Garmel]

wow

100,000 Christians a year are put to death by most estimates, mostly in the Middle East.

 

[Hawk]

100,000 Christians a year are put to death by most estimates, mostly in the Middle East.

Goldfly is an atheist, so religious genocide is of little practical importance to him.

 

[57Brave]

100,000 Christians a year are put to death by most estimates, mostly in the Middle East.

and thousands upon thousands of christians are murdered in the US by handguns every year -- What is your point?
Are we US responsible for every christian across the globe and their treatment we get to use as justification

Now that we are into victimization of Christians. A little context might be in order.
These tortures coverdd in the report for the most part took place 10 years ago. SO, the tortures that were used were justified because 10 years hence Muslim radicals would slaughter Christians?

what again was your point?

 

[Garmel]

and thousands upon thousands of christians are murdered in the US by handguns every year -- What is your point?
Are we US responsible for every christian across the globe and their treatment we get to use as justification

Now that we are into victimization of Christians. A little context might be in order.
These tortures coverdd in the report for the most part took place 10 years ago. SO, the tortures that were used were justified because 10 years hence Muslim radicals would slaughter Christians?

what again was your point?

Wow. What kind of a stupid point are you trying to make? LOL!

 

[goldfly]

Goldfly is an atheist, so religious genocide is of little practical importance to him.

I'm an atheist?

 

[Hawk]

I'm an atheist?

I really don't care what you are, atheism just fits my narrative.