Trade deadline thread

Carp said:
I disagree. We were obviously interested in JV before he signed with the Mets. It's all about how much the Mets are willing to eat, imo. If we can get them take on 10-15 million in 2024, I could see AA doing that. Also a possibility we get JV to agree to turn his 2025 vesting option into a mutual option with a buyout around 10 million.
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The Mets have shown a willingness to pay down contracts in exchange for better prospects, so this isn't crazy talk.

I just can't see them sending him to Atlanta and risk the narrative that they are paying Verlander millions of dollars to beat them. That organization is already a joke, and that would just be the cherry on top of the clown sundae.
 
bravesfanMatt said:
at his age what he did yesterday could change over night. he is not the same pitcher and those next few years are going to be rough.. really rough.
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Same could be said for everybody.

He is a generational superstar who is still effective.

You gotta remember clowns like Enscheff view world titles like Manfred does . . . just a piece of metal.

That's not my philosophy.
 
DirkPiggler said:
Are the Mets dumb enough to take on a guy with shoulder issues?

I'm a fan of Wright if he's got the chance to get healthy again, but would do a deal involving him for JV due to the risk. Shoulders have a nasty habit of never getting back to full strength.
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The Mets dumb? Yes they are dumb!
 
SJ24 said:
This year + he has 2 more years on his deal potentially.

That would be 4 titles since 2020.

Easily The Team Of The Decade.
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Verlander would have certainly helped us win in 2021 so we wouldn’t need to start Dylan Lee.
 
The Chosen One said:
THe Mets would have to eat a good amount of money, getting closer to Charlie's option amount, for us to decline Charlie's option.

AA is only going to want one 40 year old veteran pitcher at 20+ AAV next year, not two.

If we were paying JV maybe 25-28 million AAV, then Charlie's option is declined.

Although IMO I still prefer Charlie over JV.
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But does Charlie want to pitch next year? I would be surprised to see him turn down 20 million, but it also isn't unprecedented.
 
Wright for Verlander is a really interesting idea. This is a non starter if it’s 2022 Wright, but that guy might be gone for good.
 
SJ24 said:
Verlander is on record wanting to pitch 5-6 more years.
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That's nice. I want a million dollars, but it ain't likely to happen. He's already declining and isn't likely to throw anywhere close to 200 innings anytime soon. The likelihood of him pitching past his current contract is extremely slim.]
 
Carp said:
But does Charlie want to pitch next year? I would be surprised to see him turn down 20 million, but it also isn't unprecedented.
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I think Charlie said Atlanta is the only place he wanted to pitch before we signed him for 2021. It was Atlanta or retirement. And that's why he's kept re-extenting his 1 and 1 contract with us. The 2021 contract was just a 1 year deal no option IIRC? Then he did 2022 with option for 2023. Then did it again 2023 with an option for 2024.

Seems he wants to just go year to year with ATL only.

I also think he has the choice to not travel with the team on some road trips so he can spend time with his family. Not as exaggerated as Clemens in 2004-2005 where he only showed up on his pitching days on road trips, but he likes having the flexibility.
 
Just so we are all on the same page and talking in the same context, here is the 2022/2023 xwOBA for everyone we've been discussing:

Morton: .314/.338
Elder: .319/.311

I'm going to assume Strider and Fried are going to be at full strength in October. I'm also going to assume Wright is cooked with shoulder issues.

So that's the bar defining "impact SP"...better than the #3/#4 options Elder and Morton represent, as well as insurance for Fried and Strider.

Verlander: .255/.283
EdRod: .317/.290
Cease: .257/.313
Lorenzen: .307/.313

Verlander is an expensive aging stud, but still a stud. He is also the most complicated to acquire.

EdRod is the prototypical MOR rental, but he has a bit of extra downside due to the opt out.

Cease would be an excellent Morton replacement, but may not be available.

Lorenzen is the lowest quality option, but has the added benefit of being an option to easily move to the BP.
 
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The Chosen One said:
I think Charlie said Atlanta is the only place he wanted to pitch before we signed him for 2021. It was Atlanta or retirement. And that's why he's kept re-extenting his 1 and 1 contract with us. The 2021 contract was just a 1 year deal no option IIRC? Then he did 2022 with option for 2023. Then did it again 2023 with an option for 2024.

Seems he wants to just go year to year with ATL only
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I think it was Atl or Tampa. But either way, he has shown a willingness to forego the money and simply retire.
 
Carp said:
That's nice. I want a million dollars, but it ain't likely to happen. He's already declining and isn't likely to throw anywhere close to 200 innings anytime soon. The likelihood of him pitching past his current contract is extremely slim.]
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The Braves don’t have anyone in their rotation who will throw 200 innings anytime soon. I don’t see that as a big deal. You just wants someone who can give you 5 strong innings in 2 games in a 7 game series
 
chop2chip said:
The Braves don’t have anyone in their rotation who will throw 200 innings anytime soon. I don’t see that as a big deal. You just wants someone who can give you 5 strong innings in 2 games in a 7 game series
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That's more in relation to JV being able to pitch for another 4-5 seasons. He'll be lucky to throw 160+ inning this year after only throwing 170 last year. Expecting him to pitch another 4-5 years and be impactful is pretty silly.
 
chop2chip said:
The Braves don’t have anyone in their rotation who will throw 200 innings anytime soon. I don’t see that as a big deal. You just wants someone who can give you 5 strong innings in 2 games in a 7 game series
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Freid Verland Strider Motorn as a top 4 in a playoff series would be tough to beat. Especially when you pair it with this offense. I'd still like to add another arm to the pen.
 
Carp said:
That's more in relation to JV being able to pitch for another 4-5 seasons. He'll be lucky to throw 160+ inning this year after only throwing 170 last year. Expecting him to pitch another 4-5 years and be impactful is pretty silly.
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Our window is realistically the next 3 seasons (after that point you are likely replacing Fried and managing the decline of our core). We don’t need someone who is a stud 5 years from now
 
chop2chip said:
Our window is realistically the next 3 seasons (after that point you are likely replacing Fried and managing the decline of our core). We don’t need someone who is a stud 5 years from now
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Again, I'm not arguing about the merits of trading of JV or how good he is likely to be over the remainder of his current contract. I'm simply pointing out how silly it is to expect JV to pitch for 4-5 more seasons as an impactful starting pitcher.
 
If we can’t add Verlander or Cease.. I think Lorenzen make a lot of sense. Last few years we had one of those bullpen games always during the playoffs. I think he can give us 1-3 Innings during playoffs.

If Clase still in the market and we can add both that’s a tough to beat bullpen.
 
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