chop2chip
Well-known member
What a weird point to linger on.
Voter Purge
- Thread starter 57Brave
- Start date
What a weird point to linger on.
jpx7
Very Flirtatious, but Doubts What Love Is.
You literally didn't link to any actual cases-in-point ...
57Brave
Well-known member
http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2017/10/voter-suppression-wisconsin-election-2016/
On election night, Anthony was shocked to see Trump carry Wisconsin by nearly 23,000 votes. The state, which ranked second in the nation in voter participation in 2008 and 2012, saw its lowest turnout since 2000. More than half the state’s decline in turnout occurred in Milwaukee, which Clinton carried by a 77-18 margin, but where almost 41,000 fewer people voted in 2016 than in 2012
On election night, Anthony was shocked to see Trump carry Wisconsin by nearly 23,000 votes. The state, which ranked second in the nation in voter participation in 2008 and 2012, saw its lowest turnout since 2000. More than half the state’s decline in turnout occurred in Milwaukee, which Clinton carried by a 77-18 margin, but where almost 41,000 fewer people voted in 2016 than in 2012
cajunrevenge
Well-known member
Didn't Hillary lead the polls in Wisconsin then lose big time to Bernie in the primaries? Or was that Michigan? She only got 43% in the primary. So yeah, it's entirely likely Bernie bros stayed home rather than vote for the wicked witch.
Jaw
It's OVER 5,000!
The 2010 census counted Milwaukee's population at 595,000, with 40% being black. Given the increased enthusiasm among black voters for Obama, I can't understand how anyone is surprised that Milwaukee turnout was down from 2012.
cajunrevenge
Well-known member
Black people staying home causing Hillary to lose feels like things coming full circle after the 1994 crime bill devastated poor black communities. Yeah Hillary, blacks are really going to vote for you to fix the problems you caused.
57Brave
Well-known member
going out on a limb here but guessing a 22 year old law was not an issue with Milwaukee voters. in 2016
Would be interested to see quotes and links that attach the two
further out that limb, included in that 1995 law you so frequently bring up was mid night basketball --- thinking here funds attached to local rec areas were as important to residents as drug laws. Verging on popular
You assume inner city voters en masse oppose strengthening drug/crime laws. In 1995 to my mind local voters were in favor of that crime bill.
I mean, they live there .
What do you know about Milwaukee voters ?
More than the Supervisor of Elections ?
57Brave
Well-known member
it's all fun and games until somebody pokes somebody's eye out
https://www.aclu.org/blog/voting-ri.../unsealed-documents-show-kris-kobach-dead-set
...Part of that struggle ended today when a federal court ordered excerpts of Kris Kobach’s testimony disclosed along with other documents obtained by the American Civil Liberties Union in our challenge to his restrictive voter registration regime.
The unsealed materials confirm what many have suspected: Kobach has a ready-made plan to gut core voting rights protections enshrined in federal law. And he has been covertly lobbying Trump’s team and other officials from day one to sell them the falsehood that noncitizens are swinging elections.
As the de facto head of President Trump’s election commission, Kobach has positioned himself to lead an all-out assault on the right to vote.
Play 1: Disenfranchise new voters with severe registration restrictions
Play 2: If the law doesn’t let you suppress the vote, pull some strings to get rid of the law
Play 3: Cover your tracks
https://www.aclu.org/blog/voting-ri.../unsealed-documents-show-kris-kobach-dead-set
...Part of that struggle ended today when a federal court ordered excerpts of Kris Kobach’s testimony disclosed along with other documents obtained by the American Civil Liberties Union in our challenge to his restrictive voter registration regime.
The unsealed materials confirm what many have suspected: Kobach has a ready-made plan to gut core voting rights protections enshrined in federal law. And he has been covertly lobbying Trump’s team and other officials from day one to sell them the falsehood that noncitizens are swinging elections.
As the de facto head of President Trump’s election commission, Kobach has positioned himself to lead an all-out assault on the right to vote.
Play 1: Disenfranchise new voters with severe registration restrictions
Play 2: If the law doesn’t let you suppress the vote, pull some strings to get rid of the law
Play 3: Cover your tracks
Jaw
It's OVER 5,000!
It's crazy of Kobach to put that in writing. Especially with bullet points that disregard so many fine points.
Oh wait, he didn't. Those bullet points are just the "interpretation" of the plan. "Interpreted" by an ACLU attorney in the Racial Justice division.
Now it makes sense.
Jaw
It's OVER 5,000!
It is an interpretation. The author of the opinion piece you posted is a staff attorney in the ACLU Racial Justice Program. His job literally depends on finding things he can categorize as racially injust and then fighting them. He isn't going to come to work one day and say, "Guys, good news! Everything is good, we have achieved Racial Justice! I'm gonna pack up now and go start my own practice chasing injury settlements."
The result of the large professional victim industry we have today, of which this writer is a part, is that livelihoods and careers are dependent on finding things to portray as biased, whip people into a frenzy over them, and then get paid to fight them. You're smart enough to know this, but carry on being whipped into a frenzy. This guy probably has kids to feed and a mortgage to pay.
57Brave
Well-known member
His identification was in his byline --- he wasn't trying to hide that it was his and the ACLU's opinion.
Do you refute his "interpretation" and have data to back it up ?
If not we can let this stand that your opinion on the issue is that it was an opinion piece by people you have a low opinion. Because they are advocates and they ----------------- advocate.
here we are talking about the source rather than the issue.
That is tired. I thought you were smarter than that .
Disappointing
Do you refute his "interpretation" and have data to back it up ?
If not we can let this stand that your opinion on the issue is that it was an opinion piece by people you have a low opinion. Because they are advocates and they ----------------- advocate.
here we are talking about the source rather than the issue.
That is tired. I thought you were smarter than that .
Disappointing
57Brave
Well-known member
So let's take this point by point and show where you think the writer has it wrong.
1)
Before Kris Kobach took office as secretary of state, Kansans could register to vote the same way that people do in virtually every other state in the country: by submitting a sworn oath of citizenship under penalty of perjury. In 2013, Kobach implemented a law he had pushed through the Kansas Legislature two years earlier, requiring people to track down a citizenship document — such as a passport or birth certificate — or be barred from the ballot box. The new system proved disastrous for ordinary voters.
Large numbers of citizens — disproportionately minorities — don’t have a passport or birth certificate on hand and don’t have the money to obtain replacement documents. By December 2015, more than 35,000 Kansans had been disenfranchised — approximately 14 percent of all registration applications since the requirement went into effect. The National Voter Registration Act — popularly known as the Motor-Voter law — prohibits unduly harsh registration rules and requires that states make voter registration easy and straightforward.
Kobach’s severe documentation requirements violated the NVRA so we sued. In October 2016, the U.S. Court of Appeals for the 10th Circuit blocked the requirement for people registering at DMVs. The opinion by a George W. Bush-appointed judge found that Kobach’s law had caused a “mass denial of a fundamental constitutional right.” The court noted that before a state could impose such sweeping restrictions, there would need to be proof that significant numbers of noncitizens were actually registering to vote. But Kobach had no evidence of any real problem. He could only offer “pure speculation” that hordes of invisible immigrants were hiding out in voting booths.
..............................................................................
Boy, that sounds familiar.
Is there a problem with this section. Seems pretty clear cut and dried. Perhaps that last phrase about hiding in voting booths a little over the top for your ilk but, hey ... makes his point, doesn't he ?
1)
Before Kris Kobach took office as secretary of state, Kansans could register to vote the same way that people do in virtually every other state in the country: by submitting a sworn oath of citizenship under penalty of perjury. In 2013, Kobach implemented a law he had pushed through the Kansas Legislature two years earlier, requiring people to track down a citizenship document — such as a passport or birth certificate — or be barred from the ballot box. The new system proved disastrous for ordinary voters.
Large numbers of citizens — disproportionately minorities — don’t have a passport or birth certificate on hand and don’t have the money to obtain replacement documents. By December 2015, more than 35,000 Kansans had been disenfranchised — approximately 14 percent of all registration applications since the requirement went into effect. The National Voter Registration Act — popularly known as the Motor-Voter law — prohibits unduly harsh registration rules and requires that states make voter registration easy and straightforward.
Kobach’s severe documentation requirements violated the NVRA so we sued. In October 2016, the U.S. Court of Appeals for the 10th Circuit blocked the requirement for people registering at DMVs. The opinion by a George W. Bush-appointed judge found that Kobach’s law had caused a “mass denial of a fundamental constitutional right.” The court noted that before a state could impose such sweeping restrictions, there would need to be proof that significant numbers of noncitizens were actually registering to vote. But Kobach had no evidence of any real problem. He could only offer “pure speculation” that hordes of invisible immigrants were hiding out in voting booths.
..............................................................................
Boy, that sounds familiar.
Is there a problem with this section. Seems pretty clear cut and dried. Perhaps that last phrase about hiding in voting booths a little over the top for your ilk but, hey ... makes his point, doesn't he ?
Jaw
It's OVER 5,000!
Severe. Yes, so discriminatory to require proof of citizenship to register to vote.
What's next? Will we complain that requiring a driver's license to drive is somehow racist because minorities are somehow less able to get a driver's license?
Ooh ooh! I know! Let's say it's harder for minorities to get to the bank to sign up for a debit card, and then call it racist for stores to require shoppers to actually have the debit card with them when they pay! We can just have shoppers pledge an oath that they have the right to access whatever account number they give the cashier! After all, that's what this advocate thinks is reasonable for proving citizenship, right? Just the oath. We can trust them, especially if they already violated the law by coming into the country illegally.
This is absurd.
57Brave
Well-known member
They according to the writer are "hiding in the voting booth" ???
There is no statistical basis to strengthen ID laws. Especially in Kansas. Creating Jim Crow voting atmosphere. So noted by the judge appointed by Bush41 admin.
Anecdotal evidence that doesn't hold muster.
That is not merely the writers or my opinion but documented fact
There is no statistical basis to strengthen ID laws. Especially in Kansas. Creating Jim Crow voting atmosphere. So noted by the judge appointed by Bush41 admin.
Anecdotal evidence that doesn't hold muster.
That is not merely the writers or my opinion but documented fact
57Brave
Well-known member
The opinion by a George W. Bush-appointed judge found that Kobach’s law had caused a
“mass denial of a fundamental
constitutional right.” The court
noted that before a state could impose such sweeping restrictions, there would need to
be proof that significant numbers of
noncitizens were actually registering to
vote
can we move on to #2 ?
“mass denial of a fundamental
constitutional right.” The court
noted that before a state could impose such sweeping restrictions, there would need to
be proof that significant numbers of
noncitizens were actually registering to
vote
can we move on to #2 ?
Jaw
It's OVER 5,000!
I am supposed to ignore logic just because a judge, or a Bush appointed judge, did?
Here is my interpretation. To believe that minorities are less capable of obtaining documented proof of citizenship is racist.