Voter Purge

Nobody wants to touch this one.

The "facts and logic" crowd takes a pass when a Republican-appointed federal judge rhetorically flogs the Republican-led NC legislature for blatantly rejiggering election laws to explicitly suppress black votes. I imagine they'll take a pass on this, too.
 
Pretty sure we talked about the NC gerrymandering months ago and everyone agreed it was awful.
 
Ben Wikler‏Verified account @benwikler

Super bad, under the radar thing: Tom Brunell,

a Republican political scientist who literally wrote a book titled

"Redistricting and Representation: Why competitive elections are bad for America,"

might be appointed to oversee the census—which shapes redistricting—THIS MONTH.
 
Jaw said:
Pretty sure we talked about the NC gerrymandering months ago and everyone agreed it was awful.
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Not in this thread. You, to your credit, called out the NC legislature for their detestable changes to ballot access laws. Nobody else did. The gerrymandering issue didn't come up, but I wouldn't expect the results to be any different.

NC is particularly egregious, because Democrats can be reasonably expected to get at least 50 percent of the popular vote, but are effectively locked out of state and federal legislative representation.

I will repeat what has been my baseline point for this entire discussion. This should be a nonpartisan issue. The fact that it isn't speaks to the bad faith of the participants.
 
Stop with this sanctimonious garbage. If minorities voted Republican you wouldn't care about Gerrymandering.

The practice is wrong but you don't actually care that it disenfranchises minorities. You just care your side isn't getting votes. Its just too bad that minorities don't realize how toxic leftist policies are. Hopefully the tides are turning.
 
Julio3000 said:
Not in this thread. You, to your credit, called out the NC legislature for their detestable changes to ballot access laws. Nobody else did. The gerrymandering issue didn't come up, but I wouldn't expect the results to be any different.

NC is particularly egregious, because Democrats can be reasonably expected to get at least 50 percent of the popular vote, but are effectively locked out of state and federal legislative representation.

I will repeat what has been my baseline point for this entire discussion. This should be a nonpartisan issue. The fact that it isn't speaks to the bad faith of the participants.
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Gotcha, my mistake. FWIW, I think gerrymandering is as reprehensible as the other shenanigans NC pulled.
 
As a political centrist I would like to see open non-partisan primaries and redistricting done by independent commissions. The trend seems to be in that direction and I hope it accelerates.
 
nsacpi said:
As a political centrist I would like to see open non-partisan primaries and redistricting done by independent commissions. The trend seems to be in that direction and I hope it accelerates.
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I can't agree with you here. Things with innocent titles like "independent commissions" have a tendency to take a hard left turn in this country. Let's just make a set of laws that everyone has to follow and go from there.
 
Jaw said:
I can't agree with you here. Things with innocent titles like "independent commissions" have a tendency to take a hard left turn in this country. Let's just make a set of laws that everyone has to follow and go from there.
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Sure, but how many more times do we need to see clear evidence that the law is not being followed before figuring that more action is warranted?

Let's consider the timeline for a lot of this stuff. Congress lets the DoJ preclearance elements of the VRA lapse. Areas that were previously subject to DoJ preclearance for voting law changes immediately started making changes that effectively disenfranchised people who weren't likely to vote their way. How long will it take to clean that up? How many election cycles? It seems like if you acknowledge that it's a problem, you would have an open mind to possible remedies.
 
thethe said:
Stop with this sanctimonious garbage. If minorities voted Republican you wouldn't care about Gerrymandering.

The practice is wrong but you don't actually care that it disenfranchises minorities. You just care your side isn't getting votes. Its just too bad that minorities don't realize how toxic leftist policies are. Hopefully the tides are turning.
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Partisan gerrymandering and legislated voter suppression are anti-democratic (note the lowercase d).We should all be able to condemn it. Jaw is honest enough to do it. How about you?

you don't actually care that it disenfranchises minorities.

something something emotion blah blah facts and logic /jerkoff emoji
 
Julio3000 said:
Partisan gerrymandering and legislated voter suppression are anti-democratic (note the lowercase d).We should all be able to condemn it. Jaw is honest enough to do it. How about you?

you don't actually care that it disenfranchises minorities.

something something emotion blah blah facts and logic /jerkoff emoji
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I said in the post you quoted it was wrong. I think that should clear up where my thoughts are on this. I care about all Americans having equal opportunity in this country whether it be through voter representation or jobs.
 
thethe said:
I said in the post you quoted it was wrong. I think that should clear up where my thoughts are on this. I care about all Americans having equal opportunity in this country whether it be through voter representation or jobs.
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So, in effect, what you're saying is that YOU care that it disenfranchises minorities, but I don't. Glad we've cleared that up.
 
Julio3000 said:
Sure, but how many more times do we need to see clear evidence that the law is not being followed before figuring that more action is warranted?

Let's consider the timeline for a lot of this stuff. Congress lets the DoJ preclearance elements of the VRA lapse. Areas that were previously subject to DoJ preclearance for voting law changes immediately started making changes that effectively disenfranchised people who weren't likely to vote their way. How long will it take to clean that up? How many election cycles? It seems like if you acknowledge that it's a problem, you would have an open mind to possible remedies.
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When the states violate the laws, the courts step in and put a stop to it. That's what is happening now and that is what should happen. I think having state government officials who are accountable to both the voters and the courts is preferable to having an independent commission that's accountable to the people who appoint them.
 
Jaw said:
When the states violate the laws, the courts step in and put a stop to it. That's what is happening now and that is what should happen. I think having state government officials who are accountable to both the voters and the courts is preferable to having an independent commission that's accountable to the people who appoint them.
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I think that's a fair and reasonable point of view, with the caveat that the legislators aren't accountable to voters while the matter is being adjudicated, not to mention the fact that there is more potential for expensive and chaotic disruptions of process if the approach is purely "take what you can and let the courts sort it out."
 
thethe said:
[tw]948874586006925313[/tw]

Makes no sense why we wouldn't require ID. States were doing everything possible not to release their records. There is a reason for that.
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What does this remind you of, Thethe? Hint: rhymes with Frump frax freturns
 
DaneHill said:
What does this remind you of, Thethe? Hint: rhymes with Frump frax freturns
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Does this require a response? I don't see how the two are related at all. Keep holding out hope for the fake Russia collusion scandal. I thought most gave up on it as you don't hear 24/7 coverage of it like we did before.
 
thethe said:
Does this require a response? I don't see how the two are related at all. Keep holding out hope for the fake Russia collusion scandal. I thought most gave up on it as you don't hear 24/7 coverage of it like we did before.
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Probably doesn't require any response. I'm illustrating your hypocrisy.

And that you assume I'm referring to Russian collusion is your assumption btw. I don't know why Trump refuses to release his tax returns. But I do believe it is because there are very questionable and likely illegal things in them that would come to light.
 
DaneHill said:
Probably doesn't require any response. I'm illustrating your hypocrisy.

And that you assume I'm referring to Russian collusion is your assumption btw. I don't know why Trump refuses to release his tax returns. But I do believe it is because there are very questionable and likely illegal things in them that would come to light.
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That already happened yesterday sort of.

Look up the Fusion testimony that Feinstein released.
 
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