2016 Election Coverage: Aka Every Way You Look at it You Lose.

Of course the "don't vote for that nut " approach !!
You have been in politics. How would you run against Trump ?

He doesn't stop hitting . Jeb's campaign proved you can't have a discussion or make a policy point. You have to hit back quickly and often

The election in a nut shell ?
Make America Great
vs
a 1000 page policy paper on how Minnesota miners are getting screwed

........

who do you think wins that ?

Well, I wouldn't have used "deplorables" to describe those who were interested in voting for him. Hillary should have laid out a realistic and optimistic message in the same way she laid one out against Sanders. I think she got caught up in the rhetoric and, truth be told, maybe her polls were telling her that was her best chance.

Go back and look at her speeches from when she was First Lady and when she was running for US Senate. She had a totally different approach and was much warmer in her presentation. She went full-blown Margaret Thatcher in this race (and Thatcher would have probably lost to Trump as well).
 
She tried and couldn't. The conversation was Crooked Hillary.

Onice away from debate stage it was 24/7,

The publics attention span was measured to a tee by Trump, Ailes,Bannon,Hannity etal
 
If she played warm she would have perceived weak.

True, but she was never going to win over the Crooked Hillary crowd. My family all votes Trump and they all hated Trump, but they think Hillary is evil. There was never a message she could have spread that would have won them over. Further, I don't think any of them have ever voted for anyone that wasn't a Republican.

What Clinton needed to do was sure up her own base, which she failed spectacularly. I think 50 LB is right that she would have had much more success with a message of optimism.
 
She still would have lost Northern Michagan,Northern Wisconsin,Central Park and the rebel states.

Like you said for whatever the reason " The Deplorables" would never vote her way
 
She still would have lost Northern Michagan,Northern Wisconsin,Central Park and the rebel states.

Like you said for whatever the reason " The Deplorables" would never vote her way

The deplorables for Romney in 2012 and they lost. They didn't decide this election. You keep tip toeing around the reason why Hillary couldn't get her base out to vote. Are they sexist too?
 
Let me be clear Trump won. Not taking that away
.................................................................................................

Michael Cohen ‏@speechboy71 21m
21 minutes ago

Fun stat: more people voted for Hillary Clinton in Brooklyn than voted in each of these states: S. Dakota, N Dakota, Montana, Alaska & WY



that folks is 12 Electoral College votes.

Not that voted for either Trump or HRC

But, voted period
 
you have said that before

That was back when your explanation was Economic Anxiety.

And my point remains much the same. The Left has moved too far too quickly and has so maligned and targeted those who hold opposing views that there's been a major push back. I'm not happy that so many Evangelicals voted for Trump, but I dang sure know why they did. And if the Left tries to just dismiss it by hurling another "racist" card, they are just being lazy and will continue to fail to understand all that has happened. While I think the following Canadian's rhetoric goes too far, his understanding is spot on. Link

Trump won over Evangelicals and the old rust-belt Reagan-Democrats (who btw, were Obama voters for the most part). Link
 
This is for Sav... who continues to insist that Sanders would have waltzed into the white house

2. The Myth That Sanders Would Have Won Against Trump

It is impossible to say what would have happened under a fictional scenario, but Sanders supporters often dangle polls from early summer showing he would have performed better than Clinton against Trump. They ignored the fact that Sanders had not yet faced a real campaign against him. Clinton was in the delicate position of dealing with a large portion of voters who treated Sanders more like the Messiah than just another candidate. She was playing the long game—attacking Sanders strongly enough to win, but gently enough to avoid alienating his supporters. Given her overwhelming support from communities of color—for example, about 70 percent of African-American voters cast their ballot for her—Clinton had a firewall that would be difficult for Sanders to breach.

When Sanders promoted free college tuition—a primary part of his platform that attracted young people—that didn’t mean much for almost half of all Democrats, who don’t attend—or even plan to attend—plan to attend a secondary school. In fact, Sanders was basically telling the working poor and middle class who never planned to go beyond high school that college students—the people with even greater opportunities in life—were at the top of his priority list.

So what would have happened when Sanders hit a real opponent, someone who did not care about alienating the young college voters in his base? I have seen the opposition book assembled by Republicans for Sanders, and it was brutal. The Republicans would have torn him apart. And while Sanders supporters might delude themselves into believing that they could have defended him against all of this, there is a name for politicians who play defense all the time: losers.

Here are a few tastes of what was in store for Sanders, straight out of the Republican playbook: He thinks rape is A-OK. In 1972, when he was 31, Sanders wrote a fictitious essay in which he described a woman enjoying being raped by three men. Yes, there is an explanation for it—a long, complicated one, just like the one that would make clear why the Clinton emails story was nonsense. And we all know how well that worked out.

Then there’s the fact that Sanders was on unemployment until his mid-30s, and that he stole electricity from a neighbor after failing to pay his bills, and that he co-sponsored a bill to ship Vermont’s nuclear waste to a poor Hispanic community in Texas, where it could be dumped. You can just see the words “environmental racist” on Republican billboards. And if you can’t, I already did. They were in the Republican opposition research book as a proposal on how to frame the nuclear waste issue.

Also on the list: Sanders violated campaign finance laws, criticized Clinton for supporting the 1994 crime bill that he voted for, and he voted against the Amber Alert system. His pitch for universal health care would have been used against him too, since it was tried in his home state of Vermont and collapsed due to excessive costs. Worst of all, the Republicans also had video of Sanders at a 1985 rally thrown by the leftist Sandinista government in Nicaragua where half a million people chanted, “Here, there, everywhere/the Yankee will die,’’ while President Daniel Ortega condemned “state terrorism” by America. Sanders said, on camera, supporting the Sandinistas was “patriotic.”

The Republicans had at least four other damning Sanders videos (I don’t know what they showed), and the opposition research folder was almost 2-feet thick. (The section calling him a communist with connections to Castro alone would have cost him Florida.) In other words, the belief that Sanders would have walked into the White House based on polls taken before anyone really attacked him is a delusion built on a scaffolding of political ignorance.

Could Sanders still have won? Well, Trump won, so anything is possible. But Sanders supporters puffing up their chests as they arrogantly declare Trump would have definitely lost against their candidate deserve to be ignored.

http://www.newsweek.com/myths-cost-democrats-presidential-election-521044
 
He would have.

He was the hot hand.

If people in the rust belt looked past Trump's personal transgressions, they would have just as much look past Sanders'.

I get it, you don't like Bernie. He was filling stadiums while Hillary was barely filling gyms.

There are millions of Bernie or Bust people that sat out (no I was not one of them). You posted an image on here that shows Trump had roughly the same amount of votes that Romney did. Hillary was short 4 million of Obama's vote total. Those are votes I think Bernie has a better chance of bringing back than her. Trump hit her hard on her husband's NAFTA dealings. That's where it really hurt her most was the rust belt. His NAFTA talking points played very well in those states. That's not an issue Bernie would have had.

You're linking to an article written by a New York Times guy, and you've been railing against the media and NYT folks for being in the tank for Hillary and totally anti-Trump. Now the author has an opinion you seem to agree with. Fact is Bernie had way better trust ratings than either Donald or Hillary. He would have edged Trump in all rust belt states with the exception of Indiana. Biden probably does the same.

sturg, you've been trolling the left on here plenty since last Tuesday. Bernie was closer to being President than Ron Paul. Get over it.
 
He would have.

He was the hot hand.

If people in the rust belt looked past Trump's personal transgressions, they would have just as much look past Sanders'.

I get it, you don't like Bernie. He was filling stadiums while Hillary was barely filling gyms.

There are millions of Bernie or Bust people that sat out (no I was not one of them). You posted an image on here that shows Trump had roughly the same amount of votes that Romney did. Hillary was short 4 million of Obama's vote total. Those are votes I think Bernie has a better chance of bringing back than her. Trump hit her hard on her husband's NAFTA dealings. That's where it really hurt her most was the rust belt. His NAFTA talking points played very well in those states. That's not an issue Bernie would have had.

You're linking to an article written by a New York Times guy, and you've been railing against the media and NYT folks for being in the tank for Hillary and totally anti-Trump. Now the author has an opinion you seem to agree with. Fact is Bernie had way better trust ratings than either Donald or Hillary. He would have edged Trump in all rust belt states with the exception of Indiana. Biden probably does the same.

sturg, you've been trolling the left on here plenty since last Tuesday. Bernie was closer to being President than Ron Paul. Get over it.

LOL... i linked the article bc the guy claims to have inside knowledge of the playbook against Bernie.

Bernie faced no opposition from HRC. The socialism stigma would have been tough for Bernie to overcome, especially in the wake of Obamacare failure.

The quote about "breadlines being good" and that we should try to be Venezuela would have probably done him in alone.

And of course Bernie was closer to the WH than RP... Bernie promised the naive left a free ride, while RP spoke about economic realities and personal accountability.

The modern day left can't get enough of the freebies.

I'm over it.
 
LOL... i linked the article bc the guy claims to have inside knowledge of the playbook against Bernie.

Bernie faced no opposition from HRC. The socialism stigma would have been tough for Bernie to overcome, especially in the wake of Obamacare failure.

The quote about "breadlines being good" and that we should try to be Venezuela would have probably done him in alone.

And of course Bernie was closer to the WH than RP... Bernie promised the naive left a free ride, while RP spoke about economic realities and personal accountability.

The modern day left can't get enough of the freebies.

I'm over it.

Of course Bernie faced no opposition for HRC, because HRC knew Bernie had a ton of sway over the party and millenials so she would be screwed if she went after him more than she already was after the primaries.

"Freebies" are here to stay. So I hope you get over it one day.

I applaud you for remaining loyal to your positions all these years.

Not everyone on the left wants freebies for everything. But by now just as you aren't swaying your position on letting the free market handle healthcare, there are tons of people ready to get rid of Obamacare and replace it with a public option or universal medicare. I can want socialized medicine and not want free college (Zito shares a similar view).
 
Sanders v. Trump would have been curious. I agree that for all the shenanigans, Hillary didn't pull out the good stuff on Bernie and the Republicans would have relished the opportunity. I just think that when push came to shove, there would have been a huge (or maybe yuge) middle class defection from Sanders. In retrospect, Biden would have probably been the strongest Democratic candidate, but that wasn't happening.
 
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