Braves Spring Training news and roster competition

UNCBlue012 said:
With compete seriousness, did the Braves miss something with Gosselin? He seemed so average but he's been great with the Diamondbacks.
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I don't know if they missed. His coach at Virginia said he was one of the two or three best hitters he had ever coached, but he couldn't seem to get his legs underneath him as a pro until 2014, which was his 5th year in the Braves' system. It sometimes takes college guys a couple of years to get the aluminum out of their system, but he never seemed to be able to splice his game together. I think he's probably a 300 AB (at most) guy who plays multiple positions and contributes enough with the bat to have value.

Drury is having a nice spring as well.
 
nsacpi said:
I think Gant has had something like ten AA starts. I don't see the point in rushing any of these guys to the majors.
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Funny, I said the exact same thing IRL conversation today (talking about thr rotation. There is no reason to rush anyone to the bigs right now.
 
Braves1976 said:
Ogando has been very good so it would be a mistake to leave him off the roster, IMO. Personally, I'd rank him higher than most others in our bullpen as far as potential too.
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I remember watching him his all star year throw a shutout against the White Sox. The ball was moving all over the place, but mostly down and hard. I'm thinking, "holy ****, who is this guy?" He was awesome.

Anybody been following his recovery? How bad was it, and is he close to where he was?
 
50PoundHead said:
I don't know if they missed. His coach at Virginia said he was one of the two or three best hitters he had ever coached, but he couldn't seem to get his legs underneath him as a pro until 2014, which was his 5th year in the Braves' system. It sometimes takes college guys a couple of years to get the aluminum out of their system, but he never seemed to be able to splice his game together. I think he's probably a 300 AB (at most) guy who plays multiple positions and contributes enough with the bat to have value.

Drury is having a nice spring as well.
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Your point about aluminum is well taken. I don't know that he's going to be that limited in ABs. The rest of the guys in that MI rotation couldn't hit water from a boat. He could be a .300, 40 doubles type, and if he is, he could take over 2B and let the Judys compete at SS.

Until Touki finds the strike zone, that deal looks pretty good from our friend Stewie's side. Not nearly the hosing everyone thought.
 
GovClintonTyree said:
Your point about aluminum is well taken. I don't know that he's going to be that limited in ABs. The rest of the guys in that MI rotation couldn't hit water from a boat. He could be a .300, 40 doubles type, and if he is, he could take over 2B and let the Judys compete at SS.

Until Touki finds the strike zone, that deal looks pretty good from our friend Stewie's side. Not nearly the hosing everyone thought.
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Touki has potential ACE makeup.. was a 1st rounder. I have not doubt that Gosselin will be a productive player for the Dbacks. But he is a 27 year old utility man at this point. Maybe he becomes an everyday starter.. but you still make that trade everyday of the week and four times on Sunday. we even saved 4.5 million of what we took on by dumping Bronson off on the Dodger$..

maybe you can twist it and say, what Zona saved from the Bronson contract allowed them to get Zack.. but to say Goose for Touki looks good for Stewie is just wrong..
 
bravesfanMatt said:
Touki has potential ACE makeup.. was a 1st rounder. I have not doubt that Gosselin will be a productive player for the Dbacks. But he is a 27 year old utility man at this point. Maybe he becomes an everyday starter.. but you still make that trade everyday of the week and four times on Sunday. we even saved 4.5 million of what we took on by dumping Bronson off on the Dodger$..

maybe you can twist it and say, what Zona saved from the Bronson contract allowed them to get Zack.. but to say Goose for Touki looks good for Stewie is just wrong..
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No, I agree that the Braves goal is and should be high ceiling potential. Most of the analysis here and in the national media valued Gosselin at near zero. He may not be a zero. And Touki may win multiple Cys or may never see Atlanta.
 
GovClintonTyree said:
No, I agree that the Braves goal is and should be high ceiling potential. Most of the analysis here and in the national media valued Gosselin at near zero. He may not be a zero. And Touki may win multiple Cys or may never see Atlanta.
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I mean, in terms of getting true impact guys that are difference-makers, he basically is a 0.

He has value, and I thought so at the time of the trade, but his value is less than even Touki's current value...meaning we could trade Touki today for more than Gosselin and the D-Backs could have absolutely gotten more for him than Gosselin last year as well.
 
GovClintonTyree said:
No, I agree that the Braves goal is and should be high ceiling potential. Most of the analysis here and in the national media valued Gosselin at near zero. He may not be a zero. And Touki may win multiple Cys or may never see Atlanta.
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For the record, I always liked Gosselin even if it took a little more time for him to hit the bigs. This trade could turn out well for both sides. I have no qualms about the Braves trading him because Touki's upside is pretty impressive. He just needs to refine his game.
 
Here is my take on the how the roster for position players is going to play out. I think there are two (somewhat related) battles affecting the last two spots. There is a spot available for a righty or switch hitter who hits better righty who can play center and give Inciarte a game off now and then against lefties. Bonifacio and Francoeur are the competitors there. The other competition is for the right hand side of the platoons at second and third. The competitors there are Bonificacio, Beckham and Garcia. Bonifacio figures in both competitions, illustrating the advantage he has due to his positional versatility. If he "wins" both of these two competitions, it would also open up the possibility of the team keeping both Swisher and Bourn. Interestingly enough, if Bonficacio doesn't make the team, one of Bourn/Swisher is also likely to go (barring injury).

With that as a preamble, here is how I see the team shaping up when it breaks camp.

Catcher obviously is a platoon of Flowers/Pierzynski.

Third I believe will be a platoon of Johnson/Bonifacio. I like Garcia, but barring injuries, I think he starts the year in AAA. Even in that scenario he is going to get about 300 at bats in the majors this year.

Short is Aybar. Bonifacio, Peterson and Beckham could all fill in on a short-term basis. If Aybar goes on the DL or is traded, Castro would likely take over at short.

Second is a platoon of Peterson/Beckham.

First is Freeman, with Swisher or Kelly Johnson as backups.

Starting outfield is Olivera, Inciarte and Markakis. Bourn will play some in left. Swisher will be our main bat on the bench and will play some at corner outfield/first/DH as injuries arise.

I think the guys on major league deals have a slight advantage over the guys on minor league deals or with options (Francoeur, Garcia) in the battle for the last two spots. It is not determinative, but if the other factors are close it will come into play.

I like the depth we will have in AAA: Lavarnway, Brignac, Castro, Garcia, Frieman, Smith, Francoeur. We have cover for all positions and a good mix of lefty and righty hitting batters. In particular Brignac could fill in as the lefty part of a platoon at either third or second.
 
A lot of interchangeable parts, so makes the position battles especially tough to handicap this year. A few thoughts on some of the spots up for grabs . . .

- Barring an injury to Freeman, I think Swisher is gone. Let's hope he continues his good fortune at the plate so we can get $500k for him. He doesn't defend any position well, and my gut tells me the Braves don't prefer his "always on" personality.
- I'm personally not as high on Adonis as many here, but I think the Braves want to see what he can do at 3B. Just hard for me to see how the offense will be worth the defensive shortcomings, but we shall see. I see him getting the majority of at bats here in the short run, but pretty consistently getting replaced by Beckham / Peterson late in games for defense.
- KJ has played as much 2B as Jace this Spring. I'm starting to think he'll play a lot at 2B (and less at 3B). I'm very concerned about KJs defense at 2B. They seem more focused on getting Jace experience as a super-utility guy instead of establishing chemistry between him and the new shortstop.
- If the Braves are as concerned about Boni as Bowman has suggested, I think Francoeur is the likely beneficiary. Not sure which would be the lesser of two evils, honestly.
 
Neal Cotts is someone to watch this week. HOU will probably keep him, but if they don't, we need to be on the phone with his agent pronto. He's no spring chicken, but still a solid LOOGY.

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Of the guys I have making the team, the one I think is most at risk of being cut is Bourn. The team wants someone who can spell Oliveira in left and pinch run for him and go in for defense late in games. Bourn fits that role. But it could also be performed by Peterson and Bonifacio.

Between Swisher and Francoeur, I think two things favor Swisher. One is the ML contract as I mentioned. The second is Swisher being a switch hitter. The team will need a pinch hitter against righties more than against lefties. If there is no Swisher, we will often be in a situation where Bourn is our best option against a rigthy (I'm assuming Johnson and Peterson will start quite often and not be available as pinch hitters when they do). I think a case can be made for having both Swisher and Francoeur on the bench. In that scenario, Bourn or Bonifacio would be let go.
 
nsacpi said:
Of the guys I have making the team, the one I think is most at risk of being cut is Bourn. The team wants someone who can spell Oliveira in left and pinch run for him and go in for defense late in games. Bourn fits that role. But it could also be performed by Peterson and Bonifacio.

Between Swisher and Francoeur, I think two things favor Swisher. One is the ML contract as I mentioned. The second is Swisher being a switch hitter. The team will need a pinch hitter against righties more than against lefties. If there is no Swisher, we will often be in a situation where Bourn is our best option against a rigthy (I'm assuming Johnson and Peterson will start quite often and not be available as pinch hitters when they do). I think a case can be made for having both Swisher and Francoeur on the bench. In that scenario, Bourn or Bonifacio would be let go.
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I was thinking about that while following the game today. I wonder if there is any market for Bourn.

I think they let Francoeur go, but there are a lot of moving parts right now. I can see any number of combinations.
 
I think our bench will play like this.

Gracia/Aybar/Peterson/FF/AJ/HO/Ender/Nick are starters...
they will go with 12 pitchers.. so that laves 5 spots.

KJ/Flowers/Beckham are locks IMO.. Beckham might be on a short leash..
But that leaves 2 spots for Frenchy/Boni/Swisher and Bourn...I think they are going to try to see if Frenchy will stay on a minor league deal to be available as soon as a move is made.. But they will go with Bourn and Swisher because they need outfield depth...plus they are wanting to recoup anything they can from those contracts.
So bench will be Flowers/KJ/Beckham/Bourn/Swisher...
Boni will be cut and Frenchy will be reassigned to AAA..
 
Sometimes these decisions get deferred by a mysterious late spring training injury.

Sometimes managerial sentiment comes into play. My reading is the players Fredi "likes" are Beckham, Bourn and Francoeur. Those are the guys he seems to talk up. Jace is in that group too. The guys he seems to "like less" are Garcia, Bonifacio and Swisher.
 
I think Bonifacio probably gets the last spot because he can play both IF and OF. My guess is they will try to find a taker for Swisher and/or Bourn, but in order to get anything in return for either of those guys, they will have to eat a lot of salary. If they can't move those guys, I think Bonifacio probably is playing for someone else come the first week of April.
 
FWIW, new MLB.com article tonight that positions the battle for the 25th spot on the roster between Francoeur and Boni.

BRADENTON, Fla. -- Emilio Bonifacio and Jeff Francoeur continued to compete for the 25th spot on the Braves' Opening Day roster on Monday at McKechnie Field, with Francoeur generating the greater offensive numbers in Atlanta's 7-3 victory over the Pirates.
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"Boni's a switch-hitter and Francoeur is a right-handed hitter, and we're looking for a right-handed guy that can play center field and spell [starter Ender] Inciarte against a lefty and give us that option," said Braves manager Fredi Gonzalez.
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And given the details of the job for which Bonifacio and Francoeur are competing, it should come as no surprise that Gonzalez has a specific game plan in place to ensure a fair and proper audition.
"I'm going to try to get them as many at-bats as I can against left-handed pitching, because that's what they're going to be facing most of the time, and we'll see where it goes," said Gonzalez.
Sounds like a down-to-the wire competition.
"I believe so, yes," said the skipper.
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http://m.braves.mlb.com/news/article/168414932/emilio-bonifacio-jeff-francoeur-battle-for-job
 
nsacpi said:
The underlying assumption is that Swisher isn't even in the running for that last spot and that Garcia and Bourn are shoo-ins. Bowman's been writing all spring that Swisher is a gonner. I'm not so sure.
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Bowman started out 0-2 in his bullpen predictions, but turned out correct of the lefty after that in that we gave him back to the Yankees. So his track record is as usual mixed, making it hard to determine when he has a solid source for his roster views or just giving us his own take. FWIW, Swisher is having a good spring after a slow start, he's hitting over .300 and has an OPS slightly over .800 too. While Bourn has an OPS under .600 this ST.

That said, Garcia should get a spot based on his performance last year and all this talk about his defense at third is silly given what we put up with from Chris Johnson there for years. However, I'll grant that having Simmons cover so much ground helped that and Aybar's range was bad last year so he won't help anyone at third like Simmons did.
 
With respect to starting pitching it now looks like four spots are spoken for: Teheran, Wisler, Norris and Chacin. Fifth spot is between Banuelos, Baby Harang, Folty and Gant. Probably in that order of chances though it is very close between the first two.
 
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