If the Cards Extent Heyward for...

Hawk said:
Oh lord.

When you posted at Scout you got under Bill's skin because he resented the perception that you might be scooping him. At the time I defended you because I valued your contributions, and I still do, although admittedly more from a literary perspective than out of any real interest in your 'intel'. Bill learned who you are, who you know ... and I'm just going to leave it at that. Suffice it to say that your notions of my petulancy would probably find a new, more profound basis if I had the inclination to level with you. I don't, so I wont.
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I literally laughed out loud at this. You know I met Bill at Taco Mac right? He didn't "learn" who I was by any other means. And, FYI, when I met him there I also showed him the emails I had with my source. Direct from the horse's mouth. In fact, I'd be happy to meet you somewhere in the near year and show you too. I never worked for the team in any capacity, nor do I have multiple sources within the FO. People who know me here (and have know that I have been the same poster since BEFORE the sports-boards days) know I have a single person who is very high up in the organization that serves as my information outlet. Does he tell me everything? Of course not- not even close. But we do engage occasionally on topics impacting personnel decisions and I know the Heyward story is a fact.

You shared something, I chose not to believe it in its entirety. End of story. This is not me calling you out. Have I done that to you yet? I'm not into degrading internet-machismo and toying with fragile self-worths.
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You have made multiple snark comments towards me. Starting with your first post in this thread when you "cued the laugh track." Do you understand the difference between ad hominem attacks and stating your opinion? You not believing me entirely is completely within your right and I respect that wholeheartedly. I don't respect the practice of hurling underhanded insults, however.

If you can't handle my 'snark' then learn how to use the ignore function (like Knucksie, who all of these recently omnipresent whiners could learn a thing or two from) and stop acting like a bitter jerkoff.
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Pot. Kettle. Black. Happy new year to you as well.
 
nsacpi said:
See Derek Lowe, Dan Uggla and Melvin Upton for the potential harmful effects of long-term contracts to non-core players.
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Markakis will more than likely be a solid contributor at a small salary considering inflation.
 
BRule said:
Because the Braves went to them to buy out their arby years.......according to Heyward and others, Heyward was not approached when the others were. Heyward is one year from FA, the people you mentioned were still 4-5 years from hitting the market.
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Wrong. Wren did approach Casey Close LAST year about an extension for Heyward as well (when the Braves were busy locking everyone else up). I already said what happened next- Casey said that he does not think it would be in his client's best interests to entertain an extension at that time because he (and his client) believed Jason would have a better year in 2014 which would serve as a better calculus as to his future value. To say the Braves did not try to lock up Jason after the 2013 season is a falsehood; did they make an offer? No. But the intent was there. It takes two to tango.
 
Is Casey Close also Freeman's agent. I see both Heyward and Freeman listed as Excel clients.
 
ramadon101 said:
Wrong. Wren did approach Casey Close LAST year about an extension for Heyward as well (when the Braves were busy locking everyone else up). I already said what happened next- Casey said that he does not think it would be in his client's best interests to entertain an extension at that time because he (and his client) believed Jason would have a better year in 2014 which would serve as a better calculus as to his future value. To say the Braves did not try to lock up Jason after the 2013 season is a falsehood; did they make an offer? No. But the intent was there. It takes two to tango.
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It doesn't matter how many times you CLEARLY explain it those that don't want to believe will refuse to believe.
 
ramadon101 said:
Yup.
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I guess there were some differentiating factors in their situations. One is Freeman was further away from free agency. Another was Heyward was coming off a season truncated by a broken jaw and Freeman was coming off three consistent years where his productivity was trending up. And the last differentiating factor is that Close and Heyward may see defensive value a bit differently than the club does.
 
nsacpi said:
I guess there were some differentiating factors in their situations. One is Freeman was further away from free agency. Another was Heyward was coming off a season truncated by a broken jaw and Freeman was coming off three consistent years where his productivity was trending up. And the last differentiating factor is that Close and Heyward may see defensive value a bit differently than the club does.
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I think that was acknowledged by the Braves during the 2013 off-season.
 
ramadon101 said:
I literally laughed out loud at this. You know I met Bill at Taco Mac right? He didn't "learn" who I was by any other means. And, FYI, when I met him there I also showed him the emails I had with my source. Direct from the horse's mouth. In fact, I'd be happy to meet you somewhere in the near year and show you too. I never worked for the team in any capacity, nor do I have multiple sources within the FO. People who know me here (and have know that I have been the same poster since BEFORE the sports-boards days) know I have a single person who is very high up in the organization that serves as my information outlet. Does he tell me everything? Of course not- not even close. But we do engage occasionally on topics impacting personnel decisions and I know the Heyward story is a fact.

You have made multiple snark comments towards me. Starting with your first post in this thread when you "cued the laugh track." Do you understand the difference between ad hominem attacks and stating your opinion? You not believing me entirely is completely within your right and I respect that wholeheartedly. I don't respect the practice of hurling underhanded insults, however.

Pot. Kettle. Black. Happy new year to you as well.
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I never heard the Taco Mac story, but I love that place. I always go to the one downtown before games. Would be happy to meet you, or anyone else who posts here, for a drink or two before a game. On me. In fact, I think I would actually like that a great deal. Consider it an open offer.

Honestly, the version of events which were recounted to me differ a great deal from yours. This is not coming from Bill. And that's fine, not to angle that there is a definitive truth to be told here ... because it's just not that important to me or anyone else who posts here.

I do, however, take issue with the perpetuation of your version of events relating to the Heyward trade especially when they are coming from an individual who is clearly vested in protecting the interests of the organization. So I'm asking you to use reason when you shoot down the dissenting opinion out of respect toward a differing viewpoint which is equally as valid and steeped in factuality.

Like I said, I have never attacked you directly. But I have no problems attacking anyone who posts 'opinion' on the Heyward 'negotiations' in absolutes. That's seriously problematic to me and nobody wants to read about it anymore.
 
I don't think anybody really cares to read anything related to Heyward,the Braves, and an extension. That horse has been slaughtered then beaten then slaughtered again.

Oh wait, who am I kidding? It is all of our guilty pleasure. Nothing better than good ol' assymetrical information debate!
 
ramadon101 said:
Wrong. Wren did approach Casey Close LAST year about an extension for Heyward as well (when the Braves were busy locking everyone else up). I already said what happened next- Casey said that he does not think it would be in his client's best interests to entertain an extension at that time because he (and his client) believed Jason would have a better year in 2014 which would serve as a better calculus as to his future value. To say the Braves did not try to lock up Jason after the 2013 season is a falsehood; did they make an offer? No. But the intent was there. It takes two to tango.
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Last year, meaning he's a year and a half away from being a FA.....Simmons was 4 years / Freeman was 3 / Kim was 3 / T was 4........so AGAIN.....not the same situation.

AGAIN........per Heyward, the Braves never offered him a deal. I'm not doing this stupid dance again
 
Hawk said:
I never heard the Taco Mac story, but I love that place. I always go to the one downtown before games. Would be happy to meet you, or anyone else who posts here, for a drink or two before a game. On me. In fact, I think I would actually like that a great deal. Consider it an open offer.

Honestly, the version of events which were recounted to me differ a great deal from yours. This is not coming from Bill. And that's fine, not to angle that there is a definitive truth to be told here ... because it's just not that important to me or anyone else who posts here.

I do, however, take issue with the perpetuation of your version of events relating to the Heyward trade especially when they are coming from an individual who is clearly vested in protecting the interests of the organization. So I'm asking you to use reason when you shoot down the dissenting opinion out of respect toward a differing viewpoint which is equally as valid and steeped in factuality.

Like I said, I have never attacked you directly. But I have no problems attacking anyone who posts 'opinion' on the Heyward 'negotiations' in absolutes. That's seriously problematic to me and nobody wants to read about it anymore.
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Sure- lets plan on a Taco Mac pre-game meeting sometime and we can stick around and watch the game during the season. FYI I'm heading up my firm's expansion of another office these days so I'm only in Atlanta 1 - 1.5 weeks a month (and when I'm here, I try and spend time with my children since I don't get to see them that often).

For the record- I understand the concept of discounting statements made by the FO because you're right about the fact that they do have an obvious vested interest in protecting their own rears. I get that. I still don't have any reason to question the version I received, but I also acknowledge I wasn't in the room with Close and the Braves contingent.
 
BRule said:
Last year, meaning he's a year and a half away from being a FA.....Simmons was 4 years / Freeman was 3 / Kim was 3 / T was 4........so AGAIN.....not the same situation.

AGAIN........per Heyward, the Braves never offered him a deal. I'm not doing this stupid dance again
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And again, technically he's right. He was never offered a deal.. But HIS own agent is the one who spurned the Braves away from talking about the parameters of an extension after 2013. Heyward was never present during these meetings, FYI. In case you don't know, teams are only allowed to require a player to be physically present ONCE during contract negotiations. So teams don't loop in the player until and unless it's absolutely necessary (and that's far beyond any initial parameter discussions).
 
thethe said:
Why wouldn't you lock up a core of young players if they are willing to take a slight discount? That is the smartest way to build a club IMO.
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It sure is. If you don't have long term concerns with the core.
 
Heywood said:
Everyone calm down.
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everyone.gif
 
ramadon101 said:
You know I met Bill at Taco Mac right? He didn't "learn" who I was by any other means. And, FYI, when I met him there I also showed him the emails I had with my source. Direct from the horse's mouth. In fact, I'd be happy to meet you somewhere in the near year and show you too.
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I'd be up for that. Not that I really want to see the emails. I just like beer and chicken wings.
 
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