January 6th insurrection thread...

https://www.politifact.com/factchec...of-thousands-double-counted-ballots-2020-pre/

Little thethe fell for yet another hoax. Keep swinging Charlie Brown, you will hit that football one of these days.



never-give-up-cpnts-charlie-brown-football-meme-52327997.png
 
I believe he understood a weaponized administration had it out for him and went with the strategy that result in the best outcome for him.

Its so interesting how you are such a cheerleader for the state now

Republicans are the ones who purposely want the criminal justice system to be a meat grinder. I am hoping Republicans getting the long dick of the law will motivate them to reform things for everyone instead of just crying about how they were treated.
 
LOL this stuff never gets old

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You can go back to ateast 2000 to hear Democrats complaining about the voting machines. What you cant find is any Democrat suggesting we do a post audit of the voting machines with the stated goal of removing the current president and installing a significantly unpopular loser of the last election.
 
You can go back to ateast 2000 to hear Democrats complaining about the voting machines. What you cant find is any Democrat suggesting we do a post audit of the voting machines with the stated goal of removing the current president and installing a significantly unpopular loser of the last election.

Dude, you bring up the year of the Bush vs Gore election, and then say you can't recall any Democrats suggest removing the President due to fraudulent counts?
 
Dude, you bring up the year of the Bush vs Gore election, and then say you can't recall any Democrats suggest removing the President due to fraudulent counts?

Ummmmmmmmmmm I'm pretty sure no one in 2000 was saying Gore would be put in place as president in August. Democrats were rightfully pissed about that election result, but didn't try and overthrow the certification of the vote. You're comparing throwing a punch to dropping a bomb.
 
Ummmmmmmmmmm I'm pretty sure no one in 2000 was saying Gore would be put in place as president in August. Democrats were rightfully pissed about that election result, but didn't try and overthrow the certification of the vote. You're comparing throwing a punch to dropping a bomb.

I think there was a movement by a small number of Dems to challenge electoral votes in either 2000 or 2004. But it fizzled out because Gore and/or Kerry came out and explicitly disavowed it.

But yeah, we have never seen a challenge to our constitutional provisions for the peaceful transfer of power like the one we are going through now. It is a very sad and damaging thing to our country and to the constitutional principles on which it is built.
 
Ummmmmmmmmmm I'm pretty sure no one in 2000 was saying Gore would be put in place as president in August. Democrats were rightfully pissed about that election result, but didn't try and overthrow the certification of the vote. You're comparing throwing a punch to dropping a bomb.

It's easy for me to forget that not everyone commenting on that election was a politically engaged adult when it happened.

Just like when Hillary lost in '16, there were massed cries of election malpractice by the media/left, calls for electors to be faithless, etc. It didn't drag out as long because the Supreme Court was proactive about settling it.

That's when the current movement to bring down the electoral college began. GWB's "Compassionate Conservativism" scared the heck out of the Democratic party, and they were sure that between trying to save the world from the climate catastrophe that was only a couple of years away and inventing the internet, Al Gore would win. Only an unjust system or cheaters could achieve any other result.
 
It's easy for me to forget that not everyone commenting on that election was a politically engaged adult when it happened.

Just like when Hillary lost in '16, there were massed cries of election malpractice by the media/left, calls for electors to be faithless, etc. It didn't drag out as long because the Supreme Court was proactive about settling it.

That's when the current movement to bring down the electoral college began. GWB's "Compassionate Conservativism" scared the heck out of the Democratic party, and they were sure that between trying to save the world from the climate catastrophe that was only a couple of years away and inventing the internet, Al Gore would win. Only an unjust system or cheaters could achieve any other result.

I've posted several congress people who urged faithless electors in the last election... And people don't care. Only when it goes against them is an attack on democracy
 
I've posted several congress people who urged faithless electors in the last election... And people don't care. Only when it goes against them is an attack on democracy

Stand for nothing but accumulation of power.

Everything we have been saying for the last decade about the left was understating their thirst for control.
 
It's easy for me to forget that not everyone commenting on that election was a politically engaged adult when it happened.

Just like when Hillary lost in '16, there were massed cries of election malpractice by the media/left, calls for electors to be faithless, etc. It didn't drag out as long because the Supreme Court was proactive about settling it.

That's when the current movement to bring down the electoral college began. GWB's "Compassionate Conservativism" scared the heck out of the Democratic party, and they were sure that between trying to save the world from the climate catastrophe that was only a couple of years away and inventing the internet, Al Gore would win. Only an unjust system or cheaters could achieve any other result.

You're not wrong, there were calls for faithless electors. It's something that always could show up. Faithless electors are silly because they wind up not doing what people want. And the majority of the faithless electors in 2016 were direct protests to Hillary and the DNC and voted against her.

You're right that the current call to bring down the EC was first mainstream in 2000 when for the first time since 1888 someone didn't win both the popular vote and the electoral college. 2016 is where it hit mainstream because Trump won by thin margins in a few states and Clinton got 3 million more votes.
 
Stand for nothing but accumulation of power.

Everything we have been saying for the last decade about the left was understating their thirst for control.

was there ever a Trump Infrastructure week ?
so please don't tell anyone about who does and doesn't stand for anything.

If memory serves the last time there was anything remotely allotted to infrastructure it would have been the last time a (D) POTUS inherited the financial mess left by his predecessor.
Oh yeah, it was the tech bubble that burst, or video games or obesity or family values
just pick one -- they are all handy
and easily convertable
 
Six months of evidence, court filings and motion hearings have created a composite sketch of the people arrested — in all their treachery or bone-headedness — and of the country many said they were fighting for.

One group dressed in combat attire, used walkie-talkies, adopted code names such as “Gator 1” and “Gator 6” and, once inside the Capitol, appeared to be searching for legislators, according to the government. One militiaman wore a patch on his vest that read “I don’t believe in anything. I’m just here for the violence,” according to an affidavit from an FBI agent.

Lawyers blame Donald Trump, the media, naivete, trauma, unemployment, the pandemic, Washington elites, their clients’ childhoods and the singular nature of the event itself.

“I got caught up in the moment,” said Josiah Colt, the Idaho man who was photographed hanging off the Senate balcony in a helmet and kneepads and sitting in the chair reserved for the vice president.

A “momentary lack of restraint” is how an attorney for Thomas Webster describes his tackling a police officer outside the Capitol.

Many of the Jan. 6 defendants had been going through a lot. This is both a sad truth and a crucial part of their legal strategy. The pandemic triggered job losses, and losses of direction and security. Searching for order and meaning, they immersed themselves in politics, conspiracy, Trump’s rhetoric and right-wing media. One attorney has cited “Trumpitis” and “Foxmania.” Lawyers have mounted what you might call an externalized-insanity argument: The defendants were hearing voices saying the presidential election would be stolen by sinister forces unless they intervened. It was a delusion, but the voices were real. And one of them belonged to the president of the United States.

Anthony Antonio lost his job because of the pandemic, moved in with friends who watched Fox News constantly and says he came to Washington because Trump commanded him. (Antonio, charged with five counts including obstruction of law enforcement during civil disorder, has yet to enter a plea.)

“The reason he was there is because he was a dumb--- and believed what he heard on Fox News,” Antonio’s attorney, Joseph Hurley, said in an interview in May.

Folly and sadness abound in these cases. When a Pennsylvania man was arrested last month on charges of stealing government property amid the chaos, among his possessions were literature titled “Step by Step To Create Hometown Militia” and a model of the U.S. Capitol made of Legos.

Patrick Stedman, a self-proclaimed dating guru from New Jersey, was flagged to the FBI by former classmates who saw him bragging publicly about participating in the first wave of rioters to breach the building, according to an affidavit. After being charged with disorderly conduct and obstruction of government procedure, Stedman continued to share his wisdom on Twitter.

“The essence of the masculine spirit is the impulse toward oblivion,” he tweeted shortly before his indictment was filed (he has pleaded not guilty). Days later, he posted: “Women will fall in love with any man so long as he’s in the arena.”

Personal baggage has been submitted as evidence. Douglas Jensen — the Iowa man who wore a “Q” shirt and stalked Capitol Police officer Eugene Goodman up a flight of stairs — is “the product of a dysfunctional childhood” spent mostly in foster care, according to his lawyer. Jensen, saddled with stress, the lawyer said, became a “true believer” in QAnon, an extremist ideology that the FBI has deemed a domestic terrorism threat.

“Maybe it was midlife crisis, the pandemic, or perhaps the message just seemed to elevate him from his ordinary life to an exalted status with an honorable goal,” his lawyer wrote last month in a petition to release Jensen from jail as he awaits trial for disrupting government business and obstructing an officer during a civil disorder. (He has pleaded not guilty.)

“In any event,” the lawyer continued, “he fell victim to this barrage of Internet sourced info and came to the Capitol, at the direction of the President of the United States, to demonstrate that he was a ‘true patriot.’ ”

A sense of victimhood still burns in some defendants, who have offered a litany of grievances while caught in the gears of the legal system.

“It’s not fair,” yelled Richard Barnett — who famously propped a foot on a desk in Nancy Pelosi’s office — referring to his detention during a March 4 hearing. “Everybody else who did things much worse are already home.”

Other lawyers have argued that their defendants are the ones who were served cocktails of misinformation. Albert Watkins, who represents multiple Jan. 6 defendants, likened them to the followers of Jim Jones, the 1970s cult leader who persuaded his followers to commit suicide by drinking grape punch spiked with cyanide.

Watkins tried the unique tactic of calling his clients “f---ing retarded” in the press. On television, the crowd that overtook the Capitol looked like a powerful, unruly mob, but participants arrived at this historic desecration burdened with “overwhelming hardships and vulnerabilities,” as Watkins said about Jacob Chansley, the so-called “QAnon Shaman,” during a recent hearing. (Chansley has pleaded not guilty to six counts, including obstructing an official proceeding.)

Now in jail awaiting trial, Chansley “struggles to cling on to and salvage his mental health,” Watkins wrote, and continues “to reconcile his role in his current lot in life” — as if the Capitol breach was something that happened to Chansley, and not the other way around.

It's a lot to absorb, psychologically and legally. The FBI is still tracking down participants and digging through their life stories. D.C. judges are handling multiple hearings per day; at least 11 were on the court's calendar on Monday alone. Defendants languish in jail as their families suffer. Attorneys are deluged with video and photo evidence produced by their own clients and gathered by the government. Amid the echoes and static of remote hearings, players are debating the differences between a principal actor and an aider or abettor, if a "momentary lapse in judgment" could last multiple hours, and whether a weapon meets the legal definition of "dangerous" if it didn't cause serious harm.

The question at the core of this massive effort is what to do with the people who led normal lives until Jan. 6, when a vortex of forces compelled them to engage in criminal behavior.

“These are weighty issues. All the judges are consumed by these issues,” said U.S. District Judge Emmett G. Sullivan during a motion hearing for Gieswein earlier this month. Many of the defendants“come to court with unblemished records — they never paid a fine over 50 bucks,” he added.

“The really interesting aspect of this is the difference between moral responsibility and criminal legal culpability,” Goelman says. “I don’t think there’s any lawful authority that would agree that because the president was telling me to go, that’s a defense.” Trump has dismissed accusations that he is responsible for any criminal behavior, noting that his speech that day included the word “peacefully” (though it ended with “fight like hell”).

https://www.washingtonpost.com/life...4f665e-d812-11eb-bb9e-70fda8c37057_story.html
 
Dude, you bring up the year of the Bush vs Gore election, and then say you can't recall any Democrats suggest removing the President due to fraudulent counts?

And who shut that down? Al Gore. He never stopped believing he won. He conceded anyways and told the people who wanted to challenge the election to stop.
 
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