Official 2017 Trade Deadilne Thread

[Southcack77]

Two pitchers won't magically make us legit contenders, especially when one of them is a middle reliever. But they do help make us close. Swarzak helps stabilize the pen while Viz is on the DL. Quintana obviously helps to stabilize the rotation. Both additions benefit the 2018 team as well.

The offense is pretty good. Not great obviously, but good enough to win a bunch of games if we had better pitching. And we hopefully get a good boost from S-Rod in the 2nd half as well. Assuming that trade went down, being a legit contender the rest of the way would require JT to keep up his recent form, Quintana to pitch considerably better in the NL, and for Folty to continue to improve and not regress. I feel pretty confident between Newcomb, Garcia, and Dickey that we can get about league average production from some combination the rest of the way. And obviously staying mostly injury free.

I get the sense you think the Braves are in the 2017 chase.

They definitely should not acquire assets for that purpose in my view.

I also don't see Sonny Gray (may not be responsive to your post) as particularly cheaper.

 

[UNCBlue012]

Carmen DeFalco‏

@CarmenDeFalco

Some Q stuff; from source, "stating to feel like it won't be long. Braves making push since weekend. Brewers and Rockies, too." #WhiteSox

"Scott Carasik‏

@CarasikS

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Braves are pushing hard for Quintana from the White Sox. Large package of prospects looking like what gets deal done.WS want a top 3 org bat"

He also said:

"Braves hesitant to part with Maitan, Acuna or Albies, though. Especially the latter as those two should be up at some point in 2018. One more note here: Braves would be most likely to part with Albies as Phillps and Camargo can both play 2B through 2017 and into 2018. And if the Braves trade Albies, it means they could be looking at Demeritte as the long-term option at 2B instead

Also of note, raBBit on twitter just said:

"Yeah I'm leaning towards Q never pitches for Sox again."

I think we pull the trigger on a trade with Albies involved. I think there's a really small chance we do for Acuna or Maitan.

Quintana (even with some strugles this year), Teheran, Folty, Dickey, Newcomb is really solid for the rest of the year.

 

[Southcack77]

Exactly right. Just too early.

Braves are a lot more likely to be a contender in 2018 if they start with Quintana/Archer on the roster.

If there aren't comparable starters with control available once they are gone the three months of injury risk may be outweighed by risk of them being off the market.

 

[jpx7]

I think we pull the trigger on a trade with Albies involved. I think there's a really small chance we do for Acuna or Maitan.

Quintana (even with some strugles this year), Teheran, Folty, Dickey, Newcomb is really solid for the rest of the year.

Barf.

 

[UNCBlue012]

Barf.

I like Quintana, but I do think his struggles this year are expecting. Maybe not to this extreme, but he had been terrific for three-plus years. If it's me, I don't trade for another pitcher unless it's Archer.

 

[bravesfanMatt]

I like Quintana, but I do think his struggles this year are expecting. Maybe not to this extreme, but he had been terrific for three-plus years. If it's me, I don't trade for another pitcher unless it's Archer.

I think the barf is for who you would give up... in no way should we be giving up our hitters. We rebuilt around pitching.. So trading for more pitching by using our few hitters is really dumb.

 

[thethe]

Our 'Needs' are going to look much different this time next year. I'm willing to hold out till that time before making any big moves. There will be players available like there are every year.

 

[Tapate50]

Our 'Needs' are going to look much different this time next year. I'm willing to hold out till that time before making any big moves. There will be players available like there are every year.

I can't disagree with this post at all.

 

[clvclv]

I think we pull the trigger on a trade with Albies involved. I think there's a really small chance we do for Acuna or Maitan.

Quintana (even with some strugles this year), Teheran, Folty, Dickey, Newcomb is really solid for the rest of the year.

Complete speculation on my part (of course), but I just have to think Acuna is untouchable. Maitan should be IMO. Albies should be as well, but not nearly as much as those two.

We all know the crowd that will twist things you say when these discussions come up, and while NO ONE is trying to compare the two, Camargo DOES provide another option at 2B in the event including Albies nets you the arm you want. No, he's not Ozzie, but a huge part of Albies' perceived FV is as a leadoff hitter - and he's just not going to be that here unless Ender gets traded. If Swanson ever gets it together, whomever's playing 2B then becomes the 8 or 9 hole hitter - and Camargo's probably quite capable of performing there.

Would I WANT to give up a package of Albies, Allard, and a couple lesser pieces to get Quintana? Of course not. Would I? Probably. Even if you don't believe in Camargo, fixing the front of the rotation that cheaply would allow you to bring in someone like Zack Cozart who could push Dansby to 2B.

As someone mentioned earlier, going to try to fix the rotation NOW is as much or more about 2018 as about making a run this season. If you've suddenly got a rotation of Quintana, Folty, Teheran, Dickey, and Newcomb with Sims, Wisler, and Blair for depth until the second half when Wright and Soroka will likely be ready, that's still plenty deep to be a contender. You'd still also have Fried and Gohara hot on their heels, plus all four 2016 draft arms (Wilson included) and Weigel in the hole in 2019, the system's still incredibly deep with no need to promote anyone any longer until they absolutely force their way up a level.

 

[sturg33]

Complete speculation on my part (of course), but I just have to think Acuna is untouchable. Maitan should be IMO. Albies should be as well, but not nearly as much as those two.

We all know the crowd that will twist things you say when these discussions come up, and while NO ONE is trying to compare the two, Camargo DOES provide another option at 2B in the event including Albies nets you the arm you want. No, he's not Ozzie, but a huge part of Albies' perceived FV is as a leadoff hitter - and he's just not going to be that here unless Ender gets traded. If Swanson ever gets it together, whomever's playing 2B then becomes the 8 or 9 hole hitter - and Camargo's probably quite capable of performing there.

Would I WANT to give up a package of Albies, Allard, and a couple lesser pieces to get Quintana? Of course not. Would I? Probably. Even if you don't believe in Camargo, fixing the front of the rotation that cheaply would allow you to bring in someone like Zack Cozart who could push Dansby to 2B.

As someone mentioned earlier, going to try to fix the rotation NOW is as much or more about 2018 as about making a run this season. If you've suddenly got a rotation of Quintana, Folty, Teheran, Dickey, and Newcomb with Sims, Wisler, and Blair for depth until the second half when Wright and Soroka will likely be ready, that's still plenty deep to be a contender. You'd still also have Fried and Gohara hot on their heels, plus all four 2016 draft arms (Wilson included) and Weigel in the hole in 2019, the system's still incredibly deep with no need to promote anyone any longer until they absolutely force their way up a level.

Didn't you suggest trading Albies for Dee Gordon earlier this year?

 

[bravesfanMatt]

Complete speculation on my part (of course), but I just have to think Acuna is untouchable. Maitan should be IMO. Albies should be as well, but not nearly as much as those two.

We all know the crowd that will twist things you say when these discussions come up, and while NO ONE is trying to compare the two, Camargo DOES provide another option at 2B in the event including Albies nets you the arm you want. No, he's not Ozzie, but a huge part of Albies' perceived FV is as a leadoff hitter - and he's just not going to be that here unless Ender gets traded. If Swanson ever gets it together, whomever's playing 2B then becomes the 8 or 9 hole hitter - and Camargo's probably quite capable of performing there.

Would I WANT to give up a package of Albies, Allard, and a couple lesser pieces to get Quintana? Of course not. Would I? Probably. Even if you don't believe in Camargo, fixing the front of the rotation that cheaply would allow you to bring in someone like Zack Cozart who could push Dansby to 2B.

As someone mentioned earlier, going to try to fix the rotation NOW is as much or more about 2018 as about making a run this season. If you've suddenly got a rotation of Quintana, Folty, Teheran, Dickey, and Newcomb with Sims, Wisler, and Blair for depth until the second half when Wright and Soroka will likely be ready, that's still plenty deep to be a contender. You'd still also have Fried and Gohara hot on their heels, plus all four 2016 draft arms (Wilson included) and Weigel in the hole in 2019, the system's still incredibly deep with no need to promote anyone any longer until they absolutely force their way up a level.

Couple of things.

-- If Ozzie is not the leadoff hitter, then we need a new manager.
-- Jo-Gun is better suited for utility not an everyday 2B. his best asset is wasted at 2B imo..
-- Q might not be fixing anyone's TOR. in fact, Allard might be a better pitcher.. Giving Allard and Ozzie is too much for us at this point
-- not a fan of replacing a 20 year old potential 2-4 WAR player who is controlled for 6+ years for a 32 year old that is going to command a big salary. I just don't like the idea of paying Cozart for what he did as a Red when we have a really good option already.

I am fine with going after Q.. I am fine with going after Q this year.. I am not fine with giving up our best hitter(s) when that is not our strength.

 

[Deester11]

Couple of things.

-- If Ozzie is not the leadoff hitter, then we need a new manager.
-- Jo-Gun is better suited for utility not an everyday 2B. his best asset is wasted at 2B imo..
-- Q might not be fixing anyone's TOR. in fact, Allard might be a better pitcher.. Giving Allard and Ozzie is too much for us at this point
-- not a fan of replacing a 20 year old potential 2-4 WAR player who is controlled for 6+ years for a 32 year old that is going to command a big salary. I just don't like the idea of paying Cozart for what he did as a Red when we have a really good option already.

I am fine with going after Q.. I am fine with going after Q this year.. I am not fine with giving up our best hitter(s) when that is not our strength.

Why do I love this post? Nice thoughts.

 

[Hudson2]

I'm just hoping this is the White Sox using us to drive up the price for Q. Coppy loves prospects and creative deals so I don't see him gutting the farm for Q, if he were gonna do that he should have done it for Sale instead.

 

[Preacher]

A couple thoughts;

- I'm very against a trade for Q or Archer this year, I'd rather find innings for Sims/Wisler/Blair to see if we have anything there, there's no rush. Its not certain, but it seems likely that you could trade for a guy like Archer/Q/Gray... or someone else in the off-season, that's when I'd prefer to do the deal.

- I know its tough for us prospect hounds, but there's going to be a big trade, the depth in the system was built for this type of move (again, I'd prefer its in the off-season) but I fully expect Coppy to put together a package of prospects that's going to make us wince, doesn't mean its going to be a bad deal for us, but we get attached to following these guys and eventually we overrate them to some degree.

- Agree with just about everyone else, Acuna/Maitan/Albies should not be moved in a package that brings back an arm.

 

[CJ9]

I know its tough for us prospect hounds, but there's going to be a big trade, the depth in the system was built for this type of move (again, I'd prefer its in the off-season) but I fully expect Coppy to put together a package of prospects that's going to make us wince, doesn't mean its going to be a bad deal for us, but we get attached to following these guys and eventually we overrate them to some degree.

As a fellow prospect hound, this is what I'm trying to prepare myself for. It's going to happen at some point. I've just been convinced this entire time that it would be for a bat. Loading up on pitching prospects is fine with me if you use them as a commodity to trade for a controllable hitter or two. But when you have three elite hitting prospects like we do right now, trading even one of them for even more pitching just seems insane to me. We need to be dealing our pitching for hitting.

 

[bravesfanMatt]

As a fellow prospect hound, this is what I'm trying to prepare myself for. It's going to happen at some point. I've just been convinced this entire time that it would be for a bat. Loading up on pitching prospects is fine with me if you use them as a commodity to trade for a controllable hitter or two. But when you have three elite hitting prospects like we do right now, trading even one of them for even more pitching just seems insane to me. We need to be dealing our pitching for hitting.

I think there are a few of us hounds. Dester is another I believe. I try to watch or listen to as many games as I can... (not as much as I did earlier this season..) So when we do trade them, I will be right with you guys as being disappointed. Heck, I am still upset we traded Povse. (btw, he has really struggled this year since the hot start)

 

[Chico]

I don't see us acuiring Quintana. If we acquired a pitcher this half I think it would be Gray in hopes he'll sign a good ole boy extension to stay in the South.

I don't like trading away prospects either, but this offseason I was thinking Fried, Weigel, Touki, and Riley could all be packaged and they have all taken a step back. Prospects are prospects as much as we all love them.

 

[Super]

As a fellow prospect hound, this is what I'm trying to prepare myself for. It's going to happen at some point. I've just been convinced this entire time that it would be for a bat. Loading up on pitching prospects is fine with me if you use them as a commodity to trade for a controllable hitter or two. But when you have three elite hitting prospects like we do right now, trading even one of them for even more pitching just seems insane to me. We need to be dealing our pitching for hitting.

Yeah, I really don't understand the point of loading up on pitching prospects if you're going to turn around and trade a bunch of prospect depth for a pitcher. Now, we have to keep in mind: the FO hasn't actually done this, there have just been reports we're in on Quintana.

But for the sake of discussion, yeah, I wouldn't understand that. I especially wouldn't be able to understand trading one of your top bats for a pitcher. It would seem a complete reversal of strategy, or at least a major diversion from it (not that we haven't seen that before..).

I really don't want to see Maitan, Acuna, or Albies dealt for anything other than an already elite, young, MLB bat.

The more time that goes on, the more I wish we didn't have Kemp in any capacity, much less for his price. I feel like having to keep him around messes up options. We should be looking for a young, cheap OFer, but with Kemp, there's no spot in LF (even though there still should be, but $$$$).

 

[Preacher]

Yeah, I really don't understand the point of loading up on pitching prospects if you're going to turn around and trade a bunch of prospect depth for a pitcher. Now, we have to keep in mind: the FO hasn't actually done this, there have just been reports we're in on Quintana.

I think this point gets really overplayed honestly. I don't see any issue with collecting pitching prospects, and then bundling a couple of them for a stud pitcher, I'm not talking specifically right now in our timeline, but big picture - you collect those assets so you can use them.

pitching prospects flame out anyway, so lets say 1 of Allard/Soroka/Gohara really make it to their upside.... that's why I don't have an issue bundling two of them and a couple lesser pieces for a guy like Q. Chances are none of them become as good as he is anyway.

 

[cajunrevenge]

I am going to go out on a limb here and say the Braves and white Sox have agreed upon Albies as the centerpiece way back during the off-season and still do but the secondary prospects are the issue. I think sending him back to AA was to protect his prospect stock last year going into the off-season knowing he would be the main bait they would use. This year they protected him again by leaving him at AAA. I wonder if drafting Wright makes them more willing to give up one of our premium starters.

How about Quintana and Swarzak for Albies - Anderson -Wentz - Pache + their choice of their favorite lower tier prospect as a throw in.