Official Offseason Thread

PawPawMaxwell said:
Seems pretty obvious to me that no one is going to exceed Freddie and no one is going to flaunt their contracts in Acuna and Albies faces. AA has never faltered in his expressions of faith in Riley and there are still tons of viable options for cleanup hitters including adjusting our lineup.
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This is actually a good point. Had we paid Donaldson what he got, we then would have set the bar for the minimum we would have to pay Freddie, just for optics if not anything else.
 
Instead of Haniger and Seager I think I would prefer Marte and Archer as a trade package since either would probably need to include Ender going back and Seattle doesn't need Ender. Castellanos would be a nice sign but would require too many years if you truly believe in Waters and Pache. Having said that, my choice right this moment would be a 1 year deal with an option and cheap dollars for Puig. Andujar and Frazier may be available the closer we get to spring training but it really looks to me like Riley is programed in at 3rd long term.
 
VirginiaBrave said:
Well, yet another big name walks away from A-town after "loving it." I remember when guys wanted to play for the Braves.
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??
he went to who gave him the most money...as he should...i'm sure he did love playing for Atlanta last season. the Braves "weren't close" to the highest offer. he wasn't going to take a far smaller contract to stay.
 
PawPawMaxwell said:
Instead of Haniger and Seager I think I would prefer Marte and Archer as a trade package since either would probably need to include Ender going back and Seattle doesn't need Ender. Castellanos would be a nice sign but would require too many years if you truly believe in Waters and Pache. Having said that, my choice right this moment would be a 1 year deal with an option and cheap dollars for Puig. Andujar and Frazier may be available the closer we get to spring training but it really looks to me like Riley is programed in at 3rd long term.
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Why would Ender need to go in a trade and why would the Ms or Pirates want him? Doesn't make much sense.
 
Carp said:
Why would Ender need to go in a trade and why would the Ms or Pirates want him? Doesn't make much sense.
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If we get an OFer we would need to get rid of an OFer IMO. Also, Ender would not be the only item going back in either package I mentioned which should be pretty obvious. The rest Ill leave to AA to figure out.
 
3b options as I see them(other than internally):

Kyle Seagar - would cost org filler if we took on the entire contract. If Seattle has to pick up 10 million or more, you're probably look at a decent, non top 10 type of guy going back.

Corey Seagar/Kris Bryant/Nolan Arenado - all would cost multiple top prospects in some sort of scenario.

Miguel Andujar - should cost less than names listed above, but likely still 1 top 5 prospect and a couple more in our top 15.

Justin Turner - in the event LA and Cleveland grow closer to a deal for Lindor.

Yandy Diaz - There is no indication he is available, but he would be a solid addition that should cost substantially less than most of the other names higher on this list.

Brock Holt - not ideal. But he can play multiple positions and would make a decent LH part of a platoon with Camargo/Riley.

Another name I would like us to pursue (though I don't expect we will) is Kelvin Gutierrez. Another Yandy Diaz type of guy who does a lot of things well, but his swing prevents him from producing much power. A little adjustment to his launch angle and you could be looking at a 2-3 win player at least.
 
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PawPawMaxwell said:
If we get an OFer we would need to get rid of an OFer IMO. Also, Ender would not be the only item going back in either package I mentioned which should be pretty obvious. The rest Ill leave to AA to figure out.
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We don't need to get rid of an OFer, especially with the extra roster spot. And, you're missing the point. Even with other prospects going back to Seattle or Pitt, there is zero reason why they would want Ender. Much of the reason they would make these trades is shed payroll. Ender would have negative value in a trade like this.
 
I know not giving him 4 years at $25 million per was a good decision long term. He's at an age that he could fall of the cliff at any moment and we don't have the payroll to absorb that kind of a contract. Still, Donaldson is going to be hard to replace.

Kris Bryant could replace him. As could Arenado. However, the price tag for either would be pretty steep and Bryant could end up being a free agent after this season if he wins his grievance.

Ozuna would be okay but Donaldson had a fWAR of 4.9 last year. Ozuna's was just 2.6. You have to go back to 2017 to get to a time where Ozuna was in the neighborhood of what Donaldson did last year.

Castellanos is a solid player as well, but again, he's probably a 2.5-3.0 fWAR player. That's still a pretty big drop from what we got from Donaldson.

There really isn't a good solution and never has been one. The choice was either take the risk on Donaldson, likely overpay in a trade, or settle for lesser production.
 
striker42 said:
I know not giving him 4 years at $25 million per was a good decision long term. He's at an age that he could fall of the cliff at any moment and we don't have the payroll to absorb that kind of a contract. Still, Donaldson is going to be hard to replace.

Kris Bryant could replace him. As could Arenado. However, the price tag for either would be pretty steep and Bryant could end up being a free agent after this season if he wins his grievance.

Ozuna would be okay but Donaldson had a fWAR of 4.9 last year. Ozuna's was just 2.6. You have to go back to 2017 to get to a time where Ozuna was in the neighborhood of what Donaldson did last year.

Castellanos is a solid player as well, but again, he's probably a 2.5-3.0 fWAR player. That's still a pretty big drop from what we got from Donaldson.

There really isn't a good solution and never has been one. The choice was either take the risk on Donaldson, likely overpay in a trade, or settle for lesser production.
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with how young the team is, it's OK if you get lesser production from that spot. especially considering JD is not going to produce at a 5-WAR rate for the next 4 years. the team is likely to organically improve.

like everyone else, tho, i think adding a legitimate bat is absolutely imperative.
 
striker42 said:
I know not giving him 4 years at $25 million per was a good decision long term. He's at an age that he could fall of the cliff at any moment and we don't have the payroll to absorb that kind of a contract. Still, Donaldson is going to be hard to replace.

Kris Bryant could replace him. As could Arenado. However, the price tag for either would be pretty steep and Bryant could end up being a free agent after this season if he wins his grievance.

Ozuna would be okay but Donaldson had a fWAR of 4.9 last year. Ozuna's was just 2.6. You have to go back to 2017 to get to a time where Ozuna was in the neighborhood of what Donaldson did last year.

Castellanos is a solid player as well, but again, he's probably a 2.5-3.0 fWAR player. That's still a pretty big drop from what we got from Donaldson.

There really isn't a good solution and never has been one. The choice was either take the risk on Donaldson, likely overpay in a trade, or settle for lesser production.
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And the reality is we’ll likely settle for lesser production. Such a disappointing scenario. And it’s not entirely AA’s fault. Let’s say he doesn’t sign Will Smith. I’m still convinced we’re in the same position. He clearly didn’t want to tie future money into Donaldson out of fear of a sunk cost. We were never going to sign him, regardless of how much we had available to us in this year’s budget. It was always about 2023 and 2024 and AA did not want to go there with JD.
 
For the posters that teach me about analytics...how bad would castellanos be at 3b?

His numbers were bad and he’s older now. But now we have shifts and less balls hit on the ground.

I don’t really think it’s an option but o don’t like the packages I’m seeing for Bryant trades
 
I know we keep comparing options to JD last year but I doubt JD does what he did last year. He’s 34 and you usually see decline start then. Bryant and Arenado are the main 2 options at this point. It’s just a matter of if AA feels comfortable with what it would cost. 2 years isn’t a huge financial investment for Bryant and he’s still in his 20’s so you know he wouldn’t decline and may be better than he has been.
 
Carp said:
We don't need to get rid of an OFer, especially with the extra roster spot. And, you're missing the point. Even with other prospects going back to Seattle or Pitt, there is zero reason why they would want Ender. Much of the reason they would make these trades is shed payroll. Ender would have negative value in a trade like this.
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Im not missing any point. If we take on any meaningful salary at this point we are going to have to get rid of some salary. BTW I already stated that Seattle has no need of Ender so you are repetitive or ignoring my point. That in itself eliminates Seattle as a trade partner. With us taking Marte and Archer Pitt rids significant salary. Ender and prospects is not too much for AA to ask. Keeping Duvall, Markakis, Acuna, Ender, and adding another starting OFer means someone has to go like it or not and extra roster spot can be better used.
 
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