Since We Had All this Money to Hand Out....Should McCann Have Been Kept?

I don't think it changes anything considering McCann's age. In fact, I think you will likely see the same approach with the players the Braves just extended. We've got them all now till their age 30 or 31 season. You will probably see them let them go at that point and rebuild with young guys coming up.
 
yeezus said:
No.

The money we spent this off-season had very little affect on this year's pay roll. Not even much to next year, really.

It's too risky for us that Hudson would not have lived up to that deal. He's 38. We have a lot of young pitching. No real reason not to give them a shot.
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I understand all that, but now we've signed Gavin Floyd for between $4-8m, and Freddy Garcia may leave camp in the five slot, and I see Hudson mentoring Lincecum and think - yeah, we should have paid Hudson.
 
KB21 said:
I don't think it changes anything considering McCann's age. In fact, I think you will likely see the same approach with the players the Braves just extended. We've got them all now till their age 30 or 31 season. You will probably see them let them go at that point and rebuild with young guys coming up.
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Most of them will get replaced. But I could see maybe an exception if a particular player looks like he will age well (it would help if he was a face of the franchise, potential HOF type player who wants to stay his entire career on club friendly terms) and the farm system has not produced a replacement at his position. It is way too early to speculate on who that might be.
 
AUTiger7222 said:
The pitchers love throwing to Gattis and Gattis is better at throwing out base runners than McCann and he's no worse at blocking balls in the dirt than McCann. The difference is minimum. We're not talking about Brian McCann from 2011 and years previous. We're talking about the 2012/2013 McCann.
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This is exactly what I'm talking about. Catchers in baseball are not like say a first baseman, or most other positions where your job is basically to play defense and that's it. Closest position to catcher is maybe the relationship between SS and 2B. Maybe. Pitchers "love" throwing to Gattis is only part of the equation with a pitcher/catcher relationship. Pitchers liking his game calling is part of it, pitcher respecting his game calling is way more important. The catcher is the leader of the defense. Not only that Mac was far and away one of the key leaders in the club house.

McCann's contributions that aren't trackable are what will be missed between he and Gattis. Gattis could be Mac's exact statistical equal but what Mac brought to the Braves on the (for lack of better word) intangible side that Gattis I don't think can.
 
I think McCann is a much better player than Gattis. He's a much more complete hitter.

I'm not worried about catching and intangibles. We saw Gattis catch a lot and I didn't see anything that keith law or gilesfan sad on Defesnse. Maybe it's b/c I've seen Doumit and Piazza catch. He looked fine to me. I don't see him costing us games.

Gattis is going to have to hit RH pitching MUCH better. He's going to need to get on base more.

But I think he's got a good shot at it. He seemed to make multiple adjustments during the year. I think it will be easier to improve when he is concentrating on 1 position instead of 2 or 3. I think knowing the plan for games he starts or not will help him mentally. He has a year of experience now. He has a vet in Laird to support him.

I think we'll miss McCann. I think C is a downgrade from last year. But I think we'll be solid there with upside potential. No way should we have come close to that Yanks contract. No way should McCann have turned it down.

Just prepare for a media storm when McCann is killing it this year with that short porch. File it away for 3 years from now when he his contract becomes an issue.
 
KB21 said:
I don't think it changes anything considering McCann's age. In fact, I think you will likely see the same approach with the players the Braves just extended. We've got them all now till their age 30 or 31 season. You will probably see them let them go at that point and rebuild with young guys coming up.
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That's exactly what Frank Wren said. He said that the good thing with all these deals is that they all run through the age 30 or 31 season or expire before hand so that it minimizes the long-term risk.
 
zitothebrave said:
This is exactly what I'm talking about. Catchers in baseball are not like say a first baseman, or most other positions where your job is basically to play defense and that's it. Closest position to catcher is maybe the relationship between SS and 2B. Maybe. Pitchers "love" throwing to Gattis is only part of the equation with a pitcher/catcher relationship. Pitchers liking his game calling is part of it, pitcher respecting his game calling is way more important. The catcher is the leader of the defense. Not only that Mac was far and away one of the key leaders in the club house.

McCann's contributions that aren't trackable are what will be missed between he and Gattis. Gattis could be Mac's exact statistical equal but what Mac brought to the Braves on the (for lack of better word) intangible side that Gattis I don't think can.
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Well if the pitchers didn't respect Gattis's game calling skills and leadership behind the plate and the way he receives pitches then they wouldn't say that they love throwing to him, now would they?
 
Dalyn said:
No. But we should've kept or replaced Hudson. That's going to hurt.
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The Braves were very smart not to give Huddy the deal the Giants did. Had he not had the severe ankle injury then it might have been a different story but coming off the ankle injury, it's a risk the Braves were smart to avoid.
 
AUTiger7222 said:
The Braves were very smart not to give Huddy the deal the Giants did. Had he not had the severe ankle injury then it might have been a different story but coming off the ankle injury, it's a risk the Braves were smart to avoid.
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That's why I included "or replaced."
 
Russ2dollas said:
I think McCann is a much better player than Gattis. He's a much more complete hitter.

I'm not worried about catching and intangibles. We saw Gattis catch a lot and I didn't see anything that keith law or gilesfan sad on Defesnse. Maybe it's b/c I've seen Doumit and Piazza catch. He looked fine to me. I don't see him costing us games.

Gattis is going to have to hit RH pitching MUCH better. He's going to need to get on base more.

But I think he's got a good shot at it. He seemed to make multiple adjustments during the year. I think it will be easier to improve when he is concentrating on 1 position instead of 2 or 3. I think knowing the plan for games he starts or not will help him mentally. He has a year of experience now. He has a vet in Laird to support him.

I think we'll miss McCann. I think C is a downgrade from last year. But I think we'll be solid there with upside potential. No way should we have come close to that Yanks contract. No way should McCann have turned it down.

Just prepare for a media storm when McCann is killing it this year with that short porch. File it away for 3 years from now when he his contract becomes an issue.
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Agreed. I think that's another thing people aren't considering. For a young player, especially a rookie who's a part-time player, it's hard enough to adjust to major-league pitching when you're only playing 1 position, but add in playing 2 or 3 positions, especially when those positions in which Gattis didn't have a lot of experience in, and what he did last year was remarkable. Now he's only focused on catching. He can concentrate fully on catching and his offense should improve just based on having a dimplier, calmer mindset.
 
AUTiger7222 said:
Who was on the FA market that you have replaced him with?
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Arroyo or Jimenez would've been perfect. I know you never disagree or question the Braves, so I know you don't agree, but going with a young 1-4 and throwing in Garcia in the 5 slot is a recipe for disaster. What happens when Beachy or Teheran spend time on the DL? Wood will have to go to the minors to stretch his arm out. Hale will cover. What if both go down? Minor, Medlen, Wood, Garcia, Hale - How does that sound to you?
 
We used 10 starters in 2013 (and 10 the year before). How is that going to look this year?

Minor
Medlen
Teheran
Beachy
Garcia
Wood
Hale
Floyd

After that it is all about who to rush. Sims? Martin? Northcraft? We will likely have to rush two of them or sign another Loe and/or Garcia. What if Floyd doesn't make it back? We will have to rush all three.
 
Dalyn said:
We used 10 starters in 2013 (and 10 the year before). How is that going to look this year?

Minor
Medlen
Teheran
Beachy
Garcia
Wood
Hale
Floyd

After that it is all about who to rush. Sims? Martin? Northcraft? We will likely have to rush two of them or sign another Loe and/or Garcia. What if Floyd doesn't make it back? We will have to rush all three.
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Starters 9 and 10 (Hale and Loe) had a total of three starts. Most years, eight deep is good enough.

The AAA rotation looks like it will be Hale, Maya, Thomas, Martin and Northcraft. Schlosser is a possibility as well. I think we have good enough starting pitching depth.

Where we are a bit short is left-handed relief.
 
nsacpi said:
Starters 9 and 10 (Hale and Loe) had a total of three starts. Most years, eight deep is good enough.

The AAA rotation looks like it will be Hale, Maya, Thomas, Martin and Northcraft. Schlosser is a possibility as well. I think we have good enough starting pitching depth.

Where we are a bit short is left-handed relief.
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Even at eight, which I agree is the optimistic minimum, we are relying on Garcia, Floyd, and Beachy.

For the record, since Maddux left we've averaged 9 1/2 starters per year. Never less than 8. High of 12.
 
Dalyn said:
Even at eight, which I agree is the optimistic minimum, we are relying on Garcia, Floyd, and Beachy.

For the record, since Maddux left we've averaged 9 1/2 starters per year. Never less than 8. High of 12.
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Agreed. The Braves do have pitching depth, but the quality of serviceable, experienced MLB-ready arms outside of the starting 5 is questionable at best. You have to hope that a crisis in Atlanta (Beachy doesn't regain form, Floyd has major setbacks, Garcia flounders -- all distinct possibilities) doesn't thrust player development into flux out of necessity. Another veteran SP option would be nice. Maybe Wren picks one up before the end of ST.
 
Santana is still out there (and getting cheaper by the minute). Only a handful of pitchers have pitched more innings than him in the last decade or so. Very durable. Still young enough for a 4-year deal not to hurt.
 
Dalyn said:
Santana is still out there (and getting cheaper by the minute). Only a handful of pitchers have pitched more innings than him in the last decade or so. Very durable. Still young enough for a 4-year deal not to hurt.
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The same Santana that hasn't pitched in major league game in over a year? The same Santana that hasn't pitched a full season in the majors in years? LOL. I know you're not trying now because he's about to turn 35 years old.
 
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