League average starters make 15 million a year. There is plenty of time before Folty were to reach that level of financial investment. The idea that this is his last shot at being a starter here is dumb.
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League average starters make 15 million a year. There is plenty of time before Folty were to reach that level of financial investment. The idea that this is his last shot at being a starter here is dumb.
bravesfanMatt
Steve Harvey'd
that was my point as well. I have no issues with anyone thinking Folty's ultimate fate lies in the pen, but this is NOT his last year as a starter. If the Braves do go that route (without good reason) then I go complete 180 on this front office and organization's ability to develop players.
It's this simple:
1) If Folty isn't starting here, he either has to be starting in AAA or in the Atlanta pen. Neither are good options and neither is good for his development.
2) The other options are Wisler, Blair, and Danks. Those options are not that good and not as good as Folty right now.
Folty has to be the #5 starter.
1) If Folty isn't starting here, he either has to be starting in AAA or in the Atlanta pen. Neither are good options and neither is good for his development.
2) The other options are Wisler, Blair, and Danks. Those options are not that good and not as good as Folty right now.
Folty has to be the #5 starter.
And Julio and four league average starters don't make you a contender.
2016 playoff teams:
Cubs - Arrieta, Lester, Hendricks, Lackey, Hammel (1 league average starter at most)
Indians - Kluber, Carrasco, Salazar, Bauer, Tomlin (2 league average starters)
Dodgers - Kershaw, Hill, Maeda, Urias, Kazmir/McCarthy (2 league average starters)
Blue Jays - Sanchez, Estrada, Happ, Stroman, Liriano (1 league average starter)
Giants - Bumgarner, Cueto, Samardzija, Moore, pick one (1 league average starter)
Red Sox - Price, Porcello, Wright, pick two (2 league average starters)
Gnats - Scherzer, Strasburg, Roark, Gonzalez, Ross (2 league average starters)
Rangers - Darvish, Hamels, Lewis, pick two (3 league average starters)
You are right. We will need some pitchers to develop into above average starters. You do that by playing them and hope they improve. Cutting bait after one full year is not how you develop guys.
Orphan Black
Approaching Buddy Hernandez Territory
I thought the Red Sox have Chris Sale.
Those were the Pitchers those playoff teams had last season.
As much as I hate to agree with Clv, he's right in regards to Folty. This is his last chance to prove he is more than a 1-2 win pitcher in Atlanta. If he doesn't take the next step (which I think he will) to being a 2-3 win pitcher this year, there is little chance the Braves keep him around.
Quite simply, the Braves have too many young pitchers that will need to be given a chance as early as next year to allow an under-performing "stuff" guy to take up space in the rotation. The Braves consider themselves "contenders" now, and contenders with a lot of young talent on the farm don't wait around for a 26 year old that can't produce 2+ WAR. We have seen those "stuff" pitchers routinely bring back out-sized returns in trades, so trading him might very well be the best way to maximize his value to the organization.
I think Folty easily produces 2-3 WAR this season and cements his spot in the 2018 rotation, but if he doesn't I could certainly see the Braves moving on from him.
If he does post a 2-3 win season, I would like to see the Braves give him a 3-5 year deal that buys out his age 26 through 29 or 30 seasons. Something like 3 years plus 1-2 option years that buy out 1-2 FA years. That would allow the Braves to trade Julio after the 2018 season, and then trade Folty after the 2019 season, and keep the line of pitchers moving.
EDIT: Looks like Folty is already controlled through his age 29 season. I suppose there is no reason to extend him unless he wants to give the Braves a team option on his age 30 season.
Quite simply, the Braves have too many young pitchers that will need to be given a chance as early as next year to allow an under-performing "stuff" guy to take up space in the rotation. The Braves consider themselves "contenders" now, and contenders with a lot of young talent on the farm don't wait around for a 26 year old that can't produce 2+ WAR. We have seen those "stuff" pitchers routinely bring back out-sized returns in trades, so trading him might very well be the best way to maximize his value to the organization.
I think Folty easily produces 2-3 WAR this season and cements his spot in the 2018 rotation, but if he doesn't I could certainly see the Braves moving on from him.
If he does post a 2-3 win season, I would like to see the Braves give him a 3-5 year deal that buys out his age 26 through 29 or 30 seasons. Something like 3 years plus 1-2 option years that buy out 1-2 FA years. That would allow the Braves to trade Julio after the 2018 season, and then trade Folty after the 2019 season, and keep the line of pitchers moving.
EDIT: Looks like Folty is already controlled through his age 29 season. I suppose there is no reason to extend him unless he wants to give the Braves a team option on his age 30 season.
bravesfanMatt
Steve Harvey'd
I think the debate was starting vs. reliever. I wouldn't be surprised if the Braves traded anyone at anytime.
nsacpi
Expects Yuge Games
The distant golden future has a major league staff mainly populated by the guys who pitched in Rome or lower last season.
The current reality is we just had to pick up guys like Colon, Dickey and Garcia to round out the rotation.
There will be an interim period between the current reality and the distant golden future when things will sort themselves out. And during this period we really do have to give guys like Folty and Wisler some additional opportunities. I wouldn't say 2017 is a make or break year for them. It is an important year for them. But I could see one or both needing another year to figure things out before going on to fine major league careers.
The current reality is we just had to pick up guys like Colon, Dickey and Garcia to round out the rotation.
There will be an interim period between the current reality and the distant golden future when things will sort themselves out. And during this period we really do have to give guys like Folty and Wisler some additional opportunities. I wouldn't say 2017 is a make or break year for them. It is an important year for them. But I could see one or both needing another year to figure things out before going on to fine major league careers.
Braves1976
It's OVER 5,000!
I wonder if the Braves will get Rob Refsnyder from the Yankees, he could be a platoon + bench piece and is being shopped. Maybe trade Krol or someone like that for him?
Braves1976
It's OVER 5,000!
I thought the Colon signing made sense, though an overpay and the Dickey signing was my favorite but I still question the Garcia trade as I am not even sure he'll stay healthy or be effective again even if so. I hated giving up as much as we did for him too. I still like Gant and he was a local too. I could see Gant doing just as well as Garcia if not better in the rotation if given a fair shot. Plus Garcia's not cheap and that money could've been better used IMO.
zbhargrove
Well-known member
If Garcia is healthy, Gant isn't even in the same ballpark. Garcia has filthy stuff if he's healthy. He was fantastic during the first half but tired out and struggled the second half. Likely because it was the first time in a long time he pitched anywhere near that amount. If he's healthy, Garcia is easily our second best pitcher.
Oklahomabrave
Anytime Now Frankie...
Guess Albies wasn't cleared yet?
nsacpi
Expects Yuge Games
no surprise they have given so at bats to him....the at bats to Davidson is more intriguing