Defense at SS and RF are two totally different animals.
There is no way in h*** that Jason has saved as many runs in RF as Freddie has created offensively.
Boston writer advocating acquiring Jason Heyward in the off season
- Thread starter tvsportscaster
- Start date
Defense at SS and RF are two totally different animals.
There is no way in h*** that Jason has saved as many runs in RF as Freddie has created offensively.
zitothebrave
Connoisseur of Minors
So WAR matters in one instance than not in another?
And potentially .6 WAR improvement is nothing?
Team by fWAR in NL
Washington - 36.9
Dodgers - 33.2
Brewers - 29.7
Cards 29.3
Braves - 29
Giants - 24.3
Giants are the perfect example of great maager getting the most of his results. Braves are a perfect example against that.
zitothebrave
Connoisseur of Minors
If Jason stopped that many more runs than the average RF how isn't he? No one has ever been able to explain why it can't except that "there's no way"
zitothebrave
Connoisseur of Minors
Who's to say he isn't woth that much?
And Jason hasn't been worth as much defensively as Freddie offensively.
Julio3000
<B>A Chip Off the Old Rock</B>
A substantial portion of the time, Jason is the best player on the field. Defense, hitting, baserunning . . . Freddie is a better hitter right now, but is probably not the best hitter on the team, at least since the first month of the season. I love Freddie, but it's a stretch to call him the best player on the team. Not a whopper, but a bit of a reach.
Wasn't it you complaining about posters being childish with the "lulz" comments?
Regardless, it doesn't change what I said. Freeman is light yrs better than Mark Grace at the same age (offensively speaking). And defensively Freeman is very underrated. Not to mention, the two players are physically nowhere similar.
But I guess I can make baseless comparisons too. Heyward is basically Lou Whitaker but playing RF.
At any point did I say defense did not matter? No. But to suggest he's better than Freeman based in large part by defense, is ridiculous. The fact remains that scoring runs is more important than preventing them. At no time did I say Heyward sucked or wasn't worth keeping around. In fact I said we should offer him and Upton both 90+ million contracts and see who accepted first, and try to trade the other (as we likely cannot afford them both).
Not according to brWAR.
And its common sense that Jason isn't worth that much defensively. Hell no RF is. RFers doesn't come anywhere remotely close to as many opportunities to contribute in the field that a hitter does at the plate.
zitothebrave
Connoisseur of Minors
Not according to fWAR..
Also if you had a clue you'd know it's called rWAR.
And what evidence do you have that he's not worth that much defensively? Key word is evidence. Not your gut feeling cause that ****'s worthless.
BremanFan88
Playing the Waiting Game
Well for someone who doesn't get many opportunities he has some pretty impressive defensive numbers. But I guess that kind of impact is minimal? It's not like we saw Doumit in RF and how big that cost us. It's weird how defense also effects pitching. Another minimal impact too I'm sure.
freeman has a. 142 OPs+ this year, Upton 144. Last year Freeman was 146. Upton was 123.
Heyward has been 113 and 109. I don't see how he's the best player on the field as not even a great hitter for his position.
zitothebrave
Connoisseur of Minors
That's the thing. We have a collection of stats hinting that our pitching benefits from something. We know it's not defense from 2B and 3B. Tron hasn't been as amazing as last year.
zitothebrave
Connoisseur of Minors
Again what evidence do you have that Jason isn't worth what UZR or DRS say he is worth? Again operative word, evidence.
BremanFan88
Playing the Waiting Game
Probably just a coincidence. I'm sure having a player leading the world in defensive runs saved isn't a huge help and of course keeping runners from taking the extra base doesn't directly affect how a pitcher works. Could be Freddie's bat though.
And when you really think about trading Jason does anyone truly understand how poor our team defense would be? Other that Simmons you are looking at a team filled with average to below average defenders. Talk about not helping your pitching staff out...
What evidence do you have that he is?
zitothebrave
Connoisseur of Minors
Braves would be amazing with an OF of Justin in RF, BJ in CF and Gattis in LF. WEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
zitothebrave
Connoisseur of Minors
Statistics that track data that quantify defensive results and puts them into calculated runs.
An attempt to quantify results. Defensive stats are still 100% subjective. They are a good tool that supports whether a player is a good defender or not, but it's laughable to attempt to quantify runs saved.