Around the League 2020 Edition

bravesfanMatt said:
Harper, Hoskin. JTR and cutch with Nola and wheeler was supposed to be unstoppable. Yet look where they are. I am all about the Mets getting big contracts in exchange for young talent.
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Unstoppable? Everyone knew the Phillies had 2 really good players in Harper and JTR, who should be 4-5 win players or better. I don't think anyone expected Cutch or Hoskins to be more than 2-3 win players at best. Wheeler has been there only 1 year and we already knew what Philly was from 2019. I don't think anyone considered them unstoppable. In fact, I think the Nats were still the favorite heading into the season.


Springer, McNeil, Arenado, and Alonso are all legit 4+ WAR players, with Springer and Arenado being consistent 5-6 WAR players. And that makes no mention of Conforto, Smith, or McCann. Not to mention, the Mets rotation is significantly better than the Phillies ever was.

That being said, that's a lot that needs to happen and I rather it doubt it comes to fruition. But that potential lineup is legit one of the best in baseball if healthy. We'd be drooling if we added Arenado or Springer to our lineup.
 
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clvclv said:
Rockies supposedly looking to get the Mutts involved in Arenado talks. Would be an interesting discussion if Arenado agrees to waive his opt-out.

Mutts could send what's left of Cano's contract back ($48 million), J. D. Davis, and Brett Baty. Davis probably plays 3B in Colorado in 2021 and moves to LF in 2022 when Baty comes up, Cano becomes their DH in 2022 if he's not released, and the Rockies can then extend Story. The Mutts fix 3B with Arenado hitting between McNeil and Conforto, and still get one of Bauer or Springer.

Really hate to admit it, but Springer/McNeil/Arenado/Conforto/Alonso/Smith (if there's a DH)/McCann/Nimmo/SS is probably as dangerous as it gets.

Now, who was that that said they weren't anything to worry about?
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There are quite a few "ifs" here. Let's wait to see what actually happens. Sounds good?
 
I probably shouldn’t have muddied my comment with Wheeler and kept the Faillies as media darlings and everyone here 2019 WS champs after signing Harper and trading for JTR. That was the lineup to put them over the top. We were all afraid. Then reality hit. Just like it would the Mets. Not sure Nolan is great outside of coors. They might be good for a year or so but then age will start catching them and they will be right where the Faillies are now.
 
Carp said:
Unstoppable? Everyone knew the Phillies had 2 really good players in Harper and JTR, who should be 4-5 win players or better. I don't think anyone expected Cutch or Hoskins to be more than 2-3 win players at best. Wheeler has been there only 1 year and we already knew what Philly was from 2019. I don't think anyone considered them unstoppable. In fact, I think the Nats were still the favorite heading into the season.


Springer, McNeil, Arenado, and Alonso are all legit 4+ WAR players, with Springer and Arenado being consistent 5-6 WAR players. And that makes no mention of Conforto, Smith, or McCann. Not to mention, the Mets rotation is significantly better than the Phillies ever was.

That being said, that's a lot that needs to happen and I rather it doubt it comes to fruition. But that potential lineup is legit one of the best in baseball if healthy. We'd be drooling if we added Arenado or Springer to our lineup.
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The Mets have a short term window of contention open over the course of the next few years, and it will be interesting to see how they proceed from here. A lot of their window depends on their generational talent DeGrom who will be 33 next year and is under contract for a few more years. They will be set to lose Syndegaard and Conforto after next year, so they might have to pony up big cash to retain both of those. Not to mention Alonso and McNeil will hit arbitration after next year for the first time and start becoming expensive. This certainly impacts how much they can take on in the short term with contracts. One major issue is that their farm system is ranked among the worst, especially after the graduation of Peterson, and since it doesn't appear Rosario will have developed into a star as hoped. So they might try and buy up big talent, but it doesn't appear they will be able to supplement that with young, cheap players. It will actually be fascinating to see how they proceed from here, since obviously like their colleagues in the Bronx, they will never have an appetite for a rebuild at any point. The Yankees have the biggest payroll, but they also supplement that with a lot of young, cheap talent. Just like the Dodgers.
 
I fully expect the Mets to do Mets things like locking up Jeff McNeil into his mid 30's and signing DeGrom to a 5 year extension. But short term, they could be a pretty big thorn in our sides.
 
UNCBlue012 said:
There are quite a few "ifs" here. Let's wait to see what actually happens. Sounds good?
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Not strictly directed at you here, so don't take this personally...

Everyone screaming about these hypothetical scenarios needs to back up and take a look at their own expectations for the Braves before *issing on everyone else's chances of being good teams. As of today, d'Arnaud is Freeman's "protection" in the #3 hole, Albies or Riley is the cleanup hitter, Pache is in LF, we have no idea when Soroka will be ready to join the rotation and go 6 or more innings, and Smith is the Closer coming off the worst year of his career.

The Mutts have more than enough resources to make those things happen - and enough money to add Bauer or another impact SP as well - while we aren't sure how much money AA has left to address the holes on offense.

It's December 17th - everything is a "what if" for EVERY team at this point, not just every other team. As AA mentioned this morning - “We’d like to get a middle of the order bat ... I’d like to say we’re going to come out of the offseason with a bat, but we might not.”
 
bravesfanMatt said:
I probably shouldn’t have muddied my comment with Wheeler and kept the Faillies as media darlings and everyone here 2019 WS champs after signing Harper and trading for JTR. That was the lineup to put them over the top. We were all afraid. Then reality hit. Just like it would the Mets. Not sure Nolan is great outside of coors. They might be good for a year or so but then age will start catching them and they will be right where the Faillies are now.
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I don't harp on the media that much (especially most of the chuckleheads in the sports media), but if one listened to the MLB network, you could have sworn the Phillies were the World Series favorites up until the day they were eliminated from the playoffs.
 
Carp said:
Unstoppable? Everyone knew the Phillies had 2 really good players in Harper and JTR, who should be 4-5 win players or better. I don't think anyone expected Cutch or Hoskins to be more than 2-3 win players at best. Wheeler has been there only 1 year and we already knew what Philly was from 2019. I don't think anyone considered them unstoppable. In fact, I think the Nats were still the favorite heading into the season.


Springer, McNeil, Arenado, and Alonso are all legit 4+ WAR players, with Springer and Arenado being consistent 5-6 WAR players. And that makes no mention of Conforto, Smith, or McCann. Not to mention, the Mets rotation is significantly better than the Phillies ever was.

That being said, that's a lot that needs to happen and I rather it doubt it comes to fruition. But that potential lineup is legit one of the best in baseball if healthy. We'd be drooling if we added Arenado or Springer to our lineup.
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just saying, Springer has put up 5+ WAR twice in five years. i wouldn’t say he’s consistently a 5-WAR guy. he’s also 31.

the Phillies were definitely super hyped up after their big offseason moves.
 
i also don’t think anyone is debating that we’d be ecstatic to add Arenado or Springer. of course we’d be happy.

but...the Mets getting Arenado isn’t like, imminent or anything.
 
Super said:
i also don’t think anyone is debating that we’d be ecstatic to add Arenado or Springer. of course we’d be happy.

but...the Mets getting Arenado isn’t like, imminent or anything.
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It comes down to the core and what is coming to the core. We have a lot of you g talent coming in and filling key roles with a sprinkle of older players still contributing while maintaining a low risk contracts. So saying the Mets are dumb trying to buy a bunch of players to compete is not even close to saying the Braves are good already. We are not even in the same boat as the muts.
 
Super said:
just saying, Springer has put up 5+ WAR twice in five years. i wouldn’t say he’s consistently a 5-WAR guy. he’s also 31.

the Phillies were definitely super hyped up after their big offseason moves.
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I use bWAR, which he has 3 of the last 5 seasons with at least 5 WAR. And obviously, that includes this season which was shortened, in which he was on pace for nearly 6 WAR over 600 PAs. And 2015 he was was at 4.2 bWAR with only 102 games. So that would be 5 of the last 6 seasons he played at a 5+ WAR pace. That's a consistent 5 WAR player in my book.

He is 31 and he's already been missing time with injury, so he certainly shouldn't be expected to maintain that production for much longer, but I don't think it's out of the question that he could put up 10+ WAR over the next 3 seasons (assuming MLB plays full seasons during these years).


Phillies were certainly hyped. But again, you can't really compare the offenses. Mets already have a potent offense without Arenado or Springer.
 
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Carp said:
He has 5+ bWAR 3 of the last 5 years prior to 2020, while being on pace for another 5+ bWAR season this year. That's a consistent 5 WAR player in my book. He is 31, so he certainly shouldn't be expected to maintain that production for much longer, but I don't think it's out of the question that he could put up 10+ WAR over the next 3 seasons (assuming full seasons).


Phillies were certainly hyped. But again, you can't really compare the offenses. Mets already have a potent offense without Arenado or Springer.
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Paying a 31 year old a long term deal based on his past production is not a recipe for success and it is not a recipe that the Braves are going to employ.

If the Mets want to pay him for five years to get two years of production that might make them a little more dangerous in the short term, but it should not be anything the Braves worry a whole lot about, particularly in the wild card era.
 
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Southcack77 said:
Paying a 31 years old a long term deal based on his past production is not a recipe for success and it is not a recipe that the Braves are going to employ.

If the Mets want to pay him for five years to get two years of production that might make them a little more dangerous in the short term, but it should not be anything the Braves worry a whole lot about, particularly in the wild card era.
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I don't disagree with any of this. I certainly am not advocating the Braves give Springer a 5+ year deal at 25 million in AAV. Even 4/100 would be pretty steep considering our situation, imo.
 
NYCBrave said:
Whatever happened to that guy by the way? He finally left peacefully??
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I haven't been following closely enough to know the comings-and-goings of the various posters. I seem to remember a Hatfields v. McCoys thing going on with Harry in the middle of it, but the rest is lost on me.
 
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